Author Topic: a fast and explosive donkey!  (Read 1860699 times)

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vag

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2490 on: June 09, 2014, 07:25:25 am »
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i upvoted a bunch of adarq's posts to restore the natural balance of things.

A noble act but in vain, you aquiring the reputation throne is inevitable...
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

Raptor

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2491 on: June 09, 2014, 07:36:33 am »
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i upvoted a bunch of adarq's posts to restore the natural balance of things.

A noble act but in vain, you aquiring the reputation throne is inevitable...

It will be tedious to start negging 3 year old posts, but hey, anything for a good cause, right?
Current PR status:

All time squat: 165 kg/Old age squat: 130 kg
All time deadlift: 184 kg/Old age deadlift: 140 kg
All time bench: 85 kg/Old age bench: 70kgx5reps
All time hip thrust (same as old age hip thrust): 160kgx5reps

LBSS

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2492 on: June 09, 2014, 11:38:45 am »
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last night headache stayed bad but i did some shoulder stability stuff (planks, paused pushups with exaggerated scap retraction, band pull aparts/pushes) and some stretching.

today my headache...stayed bad. so i took the day off work. just now getting out of bed and it's 11:30. headache is somewhat better than 7:30, when i took some aspirin and drank some more water, but still unpleasant. hopefully it'll be better in a couple of hours and i can get in a mid-afternoon workout.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

LBSS

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2493 on: June 09, 2014, 03:47:15 pm »
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tried to work out but head prevented anything resembling effort. shot around for 20 minutes and came home. water and rest.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

LBSS

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2494 on: June 10, 2014, 02:30:03 pm »
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PT visit part 2: much more satisfying. the guy did an actual evaluation of my hips, legs and lower back. then he had me do some bw squats and some with about 60-70 lbs on the bar. those aren't a good evaluation, i don't think, but back is feeling the weighted squats now.

summary:

causes
- i'm hypermobile in my lower back, knees and hips (and elbows, for that matter). not dramatically but enough that i can get into compromising positions, such as too much posterior tilt at the bottom of a squat. the fact that i'm long-torsoed and slim-waisted just adds to the instability.
- i'm getting older and the low-back/SI pain is probably just a result of accumulated stress from years of sub-optimal form. it boiled over and that's that. my tissues just aren't as limber as they were two years ago.
- as i fatigue, i bias toward my right leg. whole COM shifts right. i guess i knew this but it was interesting to have a trained observer point it out.
- doing fast squats my hips are also kind of all over the place, although this was partly from having just regular sneakers on and not being warmed up. in normal work out conditions i don't think this would be as pronounced, although if i'm honest it's probably true to some extent even then.

solutions
- no full squatting for a while, limited ROM on things like DLs and RDLs is okay.
- lots of SL stuff and low-back strength work like glute bridges, hypers, etc.
- smith squats are okay because they bias vertical torso position
- improve calf flexibility/dorsiflexion
- start adding squats back in with limited ROM and very light weight. no fatigue permitted. take a looooong time to add depth.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

Raptor

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2495 on: June 10, 2014, 02:54:03 pm »
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Quote
- improve calf flexibility/dorsiflexion

That's exactly what I thought of when I read "hypermobile" in lowerback, knees and hips (although hypermobile knees is something I have never heard of). Hypermobility sounds like a compensatory thing for a hypomobile other joint, and the only joint left would be the ankle.

But guess what? Doing these bounds will also build dorsiflexion, if you use the proper landing/planting mechanics (and you seem like you do in your videos). So...
Current PR status:

All time squat: 165 kg/Old age squat: 130 kg
All time deadlift: 184 kg/Old age deadlift: 140 kg
All time bench: 85 kg/Old age bench: 70kgx5reps
All time hip thrust (same as old age hip thrust): 160kgx5reps

T0ddday

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2496 on: June 10, 2014, 08:55:51 pm »
+3
Oh , so your bounds  are awful compared to a 10:xx 100m sprinter and a 20 year old pro long jump athlete? Soooo depressing!  :P

Jokes aside, they are not that bad. I am sure they would improve fast if you kept at them, no? That is what maria suggested too in her journal IIRC, practice makes perfect ( no shit ! ).

Well I've had some time off and won't be full bore for another month when I move to my new place.  To test my performance without training I jumped in a meet and I'm not a 10.xx sprinter anymore!  I ran 11.7 and 23.5 without training.  The 100m was ran into a 7.6 m/s headwind however which was REALLY crazy.  The officiating tent and wind guage blew over by the time we ran the 200m so I don't know what the wind was then but I'm sure it was still very strong....  Anyway, to end the journal hijack...

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I agree with you and disagree with vag, raptor, etc.... Your bounds are not acceptable because you are not getting the benefit from them.  You would be better served just doing single leg jumps then bounding like that.  It's a simple fix though:

1) Stay on the grass/turf.  As you get powerful and efficient you will get hurt on that surface. 

2) The most important point:  You MUST LEAD WITH THE HIP.  You are leading at the knee.  I commend you for trying to emulate an elite triple jumper with the butt-kick hip hinge but what you end up doing is butt-kick without your hip swing...

It's hard since you don't have stills but look at your video "Uglier bounds 2 jun 2014".  Try to pause at the top of your height at about 22 seconds or again at 23 when you are right to the left of yellow pole...  What you notice is that your back knee is almost in contact with your front foot.   

While I'm certainly not a jumper watch my video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0Rv4HycljE) and watch my peak height at 3 seconds or so and notice that before my foot comes down my knees are not close to each other.  The goal is to swing from the hip here so the foot unfolds from the butt and then swings all the way through.   Your knee is bent but your knee is not back; does that make sense?    What you really need to see is how to properly swing that hip and that's it.   That really is the recipe to all dynamic sprinting, bounding, jumping, etc.   Our fastest guy in our training group runs 10.05, our next fastest runs 10.2.  The faster one actually is worse at bounding but when still leads with the hip...  Even if you just hang your leg behind you and swing through at the hip that would be an improvement.  This is why I don't love knee bend dominant exercises like squats for athleticism because I feel it can take away the most important and powerful hinge.

--- Besides this I would take the advice of the others.  Start with single reps.  Then double reps.  Then LLRR over and over.  Also make sure that you can nail a standing transition bound.   Baby steps and you will get it.   Although form is important one thing you can do is measure your ability.  Try to see how far you can land in 5 bounds.  Get better for a few weeks.  Then make form tweaks that will make you go even farther. 




LBSS

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2497 on: June 10, 2014, 09:54:34 pm »
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god bless you t0ddday. reading what you wrote and looking back at that vid from june 2, is another way of saying it that i'm not getting enough hip extension? basically, that i'm cheating the movement by bringing my back leg forward too soon? your trail leg is REALLY trailing while mine tracks the forward foot. or something else? at any rate here's to starting from scratch and learning to do the movement a little bit properly.

at PT this afternoon:

- air squat x 50 + a bunch more in small sets

- BB squat 60 x ??? a lot, pretty fast

- SL glute bridge x 50
PT also noted that right hip flexor is tighter than left. probably that's why it's bothering me now, too much stubbornness/desire to have equal ROM.

tonight:

WEIGHT: ???
SORENESS: none
ACHES/INJURIES: low back a little tight, right hip flexor, right wrist
MENTAL STATE: meh, a bit sluggish

- warm up

- bounds x 5,5,5,5
fuck that noise, time for the t0ddday progression. will try to get more (and better quality) vid. would help to have a training partner, as usual...

- sprint 110m x 3
14.6, 14.7, 14.8 -- right hip flexor bothering me a bit, canned it. felt very slow, no burst even by my standards.

gonna do some shoulder stuff and stretch/SMR now.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

Raptor

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2498 on: June 11, 2014, 01:50:26 am »
0
Hey LBSS, do you actually do a progression (different exercises than the bounds themselves) or you go directly into bounds?

Because I suck much more than you at them, I can't even visualize in my head what to do (for the LRLR version).

I also partially disagree with Today - yeah, you might not get the hip action yet, but you get plenty of calf and foot "stimulation". So let's not ignore that part, especially for you.
Current PR status:

All time squat: 165 kg/Old age squat: 130 kg
All time deadlift: 184 kg/Old age deadlift: 140 kg
All time bench: 85 kg/Old age bench: 70kgx5reps
All time hip thrust (same as old age hip thrust): 160kgx5reps

seifullaah73

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2499 on: June 11, 2014, 03:59:32 am »
+2
Warm up drills
   - a walk, b skip quick powerful switch (heel to hams focus), a runs, dribbles small to big to run, straight leg to runs (force, reflex, go up/forward). force to hit the ground before it hits the ground knee/hip is at 90 degrees.
   - acceleration: low heel recovery, shin angle low, drive legs back before hitting the ground and drive thighs/knee forward not up
-------------------------------------------------------------
Measuring reminder:
5 toe to heel steps = 148cm
------------------------------------------------------------------------

�Strength comes from the legs, Power comes from the torso and Speed comes from the arm.� � Al Vermeil
Arm also aids the legs in driving it down with power - seifullaah73

My Progress Log
A Journey to Running fast and Jumping High
http://www.adarq.org/progress-journals-experimental-routines/my-journey-to-hypertrophy/

Raptor

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2500 on: June 11, 2014, 04:50:38 am »
0
Current PR status:

All time squat: 165 kg/Old age squat: 130 kg
All time deadlift: 184 kg/Old age deadlift: 140 kg
All time bench: 85 kg/Old age bench: 70kgx5reps
All time hip thrust (same as old age hip thrust): 160kgx5reps

seifullaah73

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2501 on: June 11, 2014, 10:22:32 am »
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This is very interesting as well:

http://inno-sport.net/Get%20Your%20Bound%20Out.htm

Very interesting article like the charts
Warm up drills
   - a walk, b skip quick powerful switch (heel to hams focus), a runs, dribbles small to big to run, straight leg to runs (force, reflex, go up/forward). force to hit the ground before it hits the ground knee/hip is at 90 degrees.
   - acceleration: low heel recovery, shin angle low, drive legs back before hitting the ground and drive thighs/knee forward not up
-------------------------------------------------------------
Measuring reminder:
5 toe to heel steps = 148cm
------------------------------------------------------------------------

�Strength comes from the legs, Power comes from the torso and Speed comes from the arm.� � Al Vermeil
Arm also aids the legs in driving it down with power - seifullaah73

My Progress Log
A Journey to Running fast and Jumping High
http://www.adarq.org/progress-journals-experimental-routines/my-journey-to-hypertrophy/

LBSS

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2502 on: June 11, 2014, 02:17:58 pm »
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i think i can get calf and foot stimulation without doing an exercise wrong. sprinting gives plenty of calf and foot stimulation, for example.

thanks for the articles, i don't know that i'd ever heard of inno-sport but i recognize myself in a lot of those problems.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

Raptor

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2503 on: June 11, 2014, 04:23:00 pm »
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Yeah, what I meant is that you're still getting some benefit. Of course you should work to get the maximum amount of benefit with the minimum injury risk from the bounds, but it takes time to perfect them. It's good that now you're aware of what to do.
Current PR status:

All time squat: 165 kg/Old age squat: 130 kg
All time deadlift: 184 kg/Old age deadlift: 140 kg
All time bench: 85 kg/Old age bench: 70kgx5reps
All time hip thrust (same as old age hip thrust): 160kgx5reps

LBSS

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Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Reply #2504 on: June 11, 2014, 09:30:50 pm »
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WEIGHT: ???
SORENESS: quads, hams a little
ACHES/INJURIES: right wrist a little, right foot (midway down the lateral side) after jogging warm-up*
MENTAL STATE: okay

- warm up

- explosive lateral step-up x 5,5,5
foot on low step (~6"), heel in front of knee, explode up focusing on full triple extension.

- depth jump @ ~12" x 3,3; @ ~18" x 3

- shoulder stability circuit x 3
-- paused push up x 10
-- three-way band rotation x 10

- reverse hyper +10 x 10,10
on bench, DB between ankles. more lower back than glutes, need conscious focus to get full glute involvement.

- layups/dribbling x 20 minutes
i am laughably bad at handling the ball, so in between sets of layups i did a bastardized and horrible version of taylorhorton's old dribbling circuit. also some free throws.

will stretch after eating, very hungry now.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter