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I'm doing RDL's right now to hit my hams harder and also because I feel that there's (currently) a less injury risk in doing them.

But I want a great, compound exercise that I'll be doing for years on end like the squat... I can't see myself doing 455lb RDL's in the future. I mean how safe is it to unrack the bar, walk backwards with it in ur hand, and then probably have shaky form doing RDL's? Not only that, but I don't even know if I'm hitting the same depth every time. There isn't as much consistency.

Do you guys recommend I just deadlift instead? I kinda miss doing it too...
I feel like there's a stigma to deadlifting around here.

Well the question is - do you REALLY need to get that heavy when doing your RDLs? Use them more as an assistance exercise in the higher rep ranges.

Quote from: Daballa100 on March 23, 2012, 05:08:10 pm

What was your concern with deadlifts if you didn't start the program with them lol?

Deadlifts have been given a bad rep for injuries lol... but then again, everytime I see people do them on youtube they do it with horrible form.

Quote from: Raptor on March 23, 2012, 05:19:16 pm

Well the question is - do you REALLY need to get that heavy when doing your RDLs? Use them more as an assistance exercise in the higher rep ranges.

Yes I do! I need to continue improving my hamstring strength, not just get them to a certain point and stop. Since I've neglected them for so long, I've been hit with jumper's knee (along with other reasons... basically quad-dominance ruined me).

Haven't read your journal, but have you been doing GHRs? I noticed an immediate improvement in how my knee felt after getting them in for a few sessions. Nowadays I have no knee pain from ME jumping/sprinting barefoot. Before I really had to ice everyday, lol.

FWIW , i vote for sticking with RDLs too:
Full deadlifts are a 'better' exercise as it has deeper ROM and stimulates more muscles, but you already have that covered with your deep squats. I don't know how much you can stimulate your hamstrings with your squats , but for me RDLs are an excellent choice to keep the squat-caused quadzillas balanced. In deadlifts you go too heavy and that may cause form and muscle targeting alterations ( using more lower back etc ), RDLs have a  much more strict form and muscle targeting inherently.
I am with raptor , keep RDLs in using higher reps , sth like 3x6-8. You might need straps though as they get too heavy , i am currently limited by my grip strength in RDLs.
About ROM , it's easy to track using how low you go beyond knees, shouldn't be more than a couple of inches anyway so keep your form tight , keep the reversing point steady and there you are.
About setup , i use something different than you: i load the bar at the ground , make the 1st rep a regular deadlift and then carry on with the RDL reps , very easy and convenient.
Just my 2 cents.

Haven't read your journal, but have you been doing GHRs? I noticed an immediate improvement in how my knee felt after getting them in for a few sessions. Nowadays I have no knee pain from ME jumping/sprinting barefoot. Before I really had to ice everyday, lol.

Yea I don't have a GHR machine/set up at my gym so I do natural GHR's. I notice my knee feels immediately better after doing about 3 sets of them supersetted with quad stretches. Plus I foam roll before and after doing them. Definitely notice an immediate difference.

I was about to suggest GHRs but they're the reason I messed up my right knee. Sure he was messed up to begin with but to do natural glute ham raises, even on top of 2 or 3 folded aerobic mats was overkill for my knee. The knee cap gets caught in one position and gets compressed when you do them so... I would reccomend against them. If you have a machine though, I have no idea how that feels/works.

I feel comfortable doing natural GHR's. Maybe my mats have less friction than yours, because my knees are never a concern doing them. If they are in the future, I can use shorter mats that will let my knees track off the edge of the mats and then the knee caps are free to move.

Wish I could try out a GHR machine though. I can't even do one rep with a natural GHR. ALMOST up to doing a full negative with no faceplant!

I don't know how much you can stimulate your hamstrings with your squats

Almost not at all lol (for me). Maybe they do get stimulated, but not even close to the amount my quads and glutes do.

I am with raptor , keep RDLs in using higher reps , sth like 3x6-8.

The thing is, I want to do the 5/3/1 program as planned. I read the entire book (~100 pages) the night I got it and I don't want to change anything. Basically, the bottom line is this:

1 year ago I was benching 210x5. 1 month ago, I was benching 210x5.

It's time for slow, consistent gains that won't go away. And that's why I chose 5/3/1. Slow progression, but it will add up over time. 5/3/1 pretty much guarantees a 5lb gain every month for upper body and 5-10lbs a month for lower body. That's 60lbs on my bench press in a year, which is more than it's ever gone up (not counting noob gains my first year). And lets count it as 90lbs on my deadlift in a year, so I can go from like 350 to 430 in one year.

That's excellent progress. Once my knee heals up, I can put 90lbs on my squat in a year and go from 380 to 470 max. AND KEEP THOSE GAINS. I've made a 70lb gain in 7 weeks using a 4/7/7 rep scheme squatting 3x a week, but those gains diminished soon after. I've done smolov jr for 9 weeks and gained 80lbs off of it, but those gains diminished as well.

Time for me to just make slow, consistent progress without even having to go overboard with frequency and stuff.

About setup , i use something different than you: i load the bar at the ground , make the 1st rep a regular deadlift and then carry on with the RDL reps , very easy and convenient.
Just my 2 cents.

Oh I see... do you count that first deadlift as part of the set? Meaning 1 deadlift plus 5 rdl's equal one set of 6?

Go low bar in the squat and see what happens with your hamstrings. You might be able to better keep the knees from going foward with a low bar squat and therefore maintain tension on your hamstrings.

Sounded like a good idea but I literally can't do low bar anymore. I tried it a few weeks ago, but there is just no spot to put the bar on my back anymore. It's not that it hurts like hell (it does), but rather, anywhere that's not in my usual high bar position will slide off the back.

I'll try again though.

I remember I switched to a low bar squat I think 2 years ago and I liked it a lot. I don't remember why I even switched back to high bar actually.

If I can squat painlessly, even after jumping, with a low bar it'll be a god-send for me. I don't want to wait another 3-4 months before I can start increasing my vertical again.

What problem did you have with your knee anyway?