Adarq.org

the shrimp fails to address this one important issue:

the ability to overcome more resistance for a given ROM than other exercises with that same ROM





so, for same ROM, bss/lunge allows you to overload far more than 'the shrimp'.. this is obviously due to the coordination factor involved with 'the shrimp'. some people might say, well that coordination issue yields more improvements in 'athletic ability' than less coordinated movements such as bss/lunge, i disagree.. the most simple multijoint movements are far more important imo.. it doesn't get any more simple than squat, lunge, bss, calve raise etc.. those are the purest forms of overloading those roms, which should allow for the greatest gains in hypertrophy/strength/various cns adaptations..

someone could say, 'well the shrimp utilizes stabilization to a higher degree, and thus has more transfer to sport'.. i would say, that stabilization is almost useless, as high speed movements work in much shorter time frames that would not stabilize the joints in that manner.. furthermore, if stabilization mattered, while lifting, we'd see much more improvements in athleticism from "the functional crowd".. weighted swiss ball pushups would be somehow utilized by shotput throwers eventually.. never going to happen.

training solely with 'weighted shrimp' would fail to improve barbell squat much more so than training solely with 'weighted bss/lunge'.. that's my opinion.. again, more overload can be utilized in a simpler movement.. so loading up 100 lb total of db's on your shoulders in a shrimp, does not compare AT ALL to loading up 225 lb on your shoulders during a bss.. i'd imagine 100 lb total during a shrimp to be 'as difficult' as 225 lb on a barbell for a bss, as an example, but that's due to the coordination factor and overall difficulty/time to complete the exercise...

^^ people might say, well who cares about squat.. but most people's goals on this site center around squat.. even short sprints.. squat is insanely beneficial for short sprints, and of course jumps of all kinds (obviously bilateral), including single leg jumps.. a heavy, bilateral barbell squat (half or quarter) is an incredible tool to highly arouse the CNS for single leg jumps, a day or two after.

the arousal needed to complete very heavy simple barbell lifts is very different than the arousal needed to complete a 'highly coordinated' weighted exercise like the shrimp.. the arousal experienced by the former, seems to be one of the most beneficial aspects of training.

my 2 cents, now im off to sleep can barely keep eyes open.

pc

I believe I'm adding plenty to the discussion.

Were "shrimps" talked about in your Engineering the Athlete book that was backed by science and can be compared to the works of Verkhoshansky ? If the answer is no, I think everyone can see why nobody should listen to a word you say.

would he include them exclusively now? it sounds like he'd use them exclusively, i mean that's the vibe i get from some of his posts.. exclusively for bilateral jumpers? or just sprinters? what about short accell?

I don't see how 'the shrimp' could improve broad jump more than a "p-chain based barbell squat".. i mean if it did, throw specificity right out of the window..

pc

What if we go the other way around? Say, with an easier exercise like the leg press vs the squat? The leg press doesn't require any stabilization that you require in the squat just as the BSS or lunge requires less stabilization vs the shrimp.

So far, less need for stabilization was actually better.

What about BSS vs Squat for one leg jumpers? You can say BSS is more specific, but uses less total weight. However, is the total weight important? Or is what important the amount of load per leg?

For example:

What would be more difficult (let's pretend the guy doing this has no issues with balancing):

5 reps with 80 kg on the BSS
OR
5 reps with 160 kg on the squat.

How do you define "difficult"? How do you define the training effect that happens after doing this ^^^? What is more important - the amount of tension that occurs in the leg in the BSS or the amount of overall "body" tension that occurs during the squat? What if you use say 130 kg on the squat? What then? Can you say that a BSS makes you aware and able to concentrate all your might (nervous energy if you will) on one limb better than a squat would do?

Obviously the thing is, in training, consistency. That's what's important. But we talk about stuff like this because we (at least I do) like the challenge of deciphering all these "enigmas" (for some, others have a strong belief in one method or another).

I think Pavel Tsatsouline said that what's most important is the amount of tension in a muscle more than anything, it doesn't matter through what methods - traditional, iso, eccentric, whatever.

What about BSS vs Squat for one leg jumpers? You can say BSS is more specific, but uses less total weight. However, is the total weight important? Or is what important the amount of load per leg?

The BSS has much less of an instability component compared to the 'shrimp'. I would say that it is a better assistance exercise, but I would still prefer barbell lunges in most situations. The squat is the best strength builder either way. I think as single leg jumper you should use both, the squat as well as a weighted unilateral, according to their role as main and assistance exercises.

It's always the people who don't get results that want to change the basics, thinking they are different. How about you increase your relative strength in the squat and stay active by jumping a lot and then see if you jump higher


Of course you're done RJ. You're mad because nobody is kissing your ass here like they used to on dbhammer. It's different on this site. We're sick of people talking as if they were gurus yet haven't done anything themselves or trained anyone. Your strength levels may be impressive compared to people on here, but let's not forget you have pretty good genetics for strength. I believe you said you bench pressed 300+ when you were 17 after only a few months of training. That's a feat that takes most people years, and probably a feat you're bs-ing just like your power snatches.

It's different here than on dbhammer. People actually get results here (for the most part). They get these results by sticking to the basics. There's no room here for "gurus" such as yourself who change their mind about what is optimal every week, and claim it's backed by science yet haven't actually seen it work themselves. People like you (and the rest of the guys from dbhammer) try to over complicate everything and that's why you get nowhere.


And of course you ignore all my posts again.

It's always the people who don't get results that want to change the basics, thinking they are different. How about you increase your relative strength in the squat and stay active by jumping a lot and then see if you jump higher


Of course you're done RJ. You're mad because nobody is kissing your ass here like they used to on dbhammer. It's different on this site. We're sick of people talking as if they were gurus yet haven't done anything themselves or trained anyone. Your strength levels may be impressive compared to people on here, but let's not forget you have pretty good genetics for strength. I believe you said you bench pressed 300+ when you were 17 after only a few months of training. That's a feat that takes most people years, and probably a feat you're bs-ing just like your power snatches.

It's different here than on dbhammer. People actually get results here (for the most part). They get these results by sticking to the basics. There's no room here for "gurus" such as yourself who change their mind about what is optimal every week, and claim it's backed by science yet haven't actually seen it work themselves. People like you (and the rest of the guys from dbhammer) try to over complicate everything and that's why you get nowhere.


And of course you ignore all my posts again.

people from dbhammer don't last very long here... if dbhammer forum was still alive, sickenin vendetta would be a respected guru on that forum, he'd be having the time of his life posting there.

lmfao

No room for weak people here. When fair questions are asked and fair points are brought up and you just leave instead of answering them, don't expect any respect.

^^, agreed.. was a valid question (regarding the book).

edit:

also, RJ was real snappy at steven-miller... i understand RJ may not know who steven-miller is, but if he snaps on people like that, I don't see how he'd expect someone like jcsbck not to have a go at him..

jfyi, steven-miller knows his sh*t, helps alot of people, and works his ass off.... his transformation has been & continues to be very impressive.