Adarq.org

So I am a HUGE NBA fan, and I always seem to notice they're training habits as well.  For one, they train way different than most of us do here on adarq.org.  Obviously this is the case because their training is more injury-prevention/endure a grinding season/have a longer career-oriented.

But I see other things too.  Like this summer, the skinny as hell Brandon Jennings says he will do boxing and martial arts to get stronger.  Now If I was a new guy to come here on adarq.org and I said, I am a quick and athletic basketball player and I need to get stronger as it is holding me back, I don't think anyone here would advise me to do boxing or martial arts, and I wouldn't advise anyone with that either.  Sure it'll help, but wouldn't a dedicated weight training routine be the best way?

I also never see NBA players training for vert/athleticism, when it can help so much for some players.  And when I do see some doing lower body lifting, they leg press over squatting.  

There are more examples but I cannot think right now.  I know these NBA players are athletically gifted, and it is not their job to know these things even though they THINK they know (example, Air Up There thinks jumping high is all abs, and no legs), but shouldn't these professional trainers the NBA organizations hire know what the fuck to do?  Or are they no different from the average personal trainer at 24 hour fitness who don't know jack shit neither?


P.S.  I know AUT is not an NBA player, but you get the idea.

When Air Up There thinks jumping high is all abs, and no legs I don't think he's trying to mislead anyone. Why don't you believe him?. Why would he lie about that?.

He's not lying or trying to mislead anyone.  I'm saying he's mis-informed.  Some guy who don't know anything possibly once told him the importance of your abs, and he prolly did a million crunches a day, and thinks his hops are a direct result of that.

If NBA players can dunk through great genetics I don't see the need for squats?.

A lot of them dunk through height.  Even if they can dunk, or even if they are athletic as hell, why not enhance that even more?  Why not go from a 34" to a 38" and become stronger and quicker in the process which will lead to improvements in every aspect of your game?

Quote from: Ineedtodunk on July 26, 2011, 12:59:18 pm

If he believes abs are the end all be all for jumping high, yes he is mis-informed as you will agree with as well.

 

If he's all abs & genetics, there is no need to put in the extra effort (legs) if he's already got hopz.

If I was in the NBA I would want to be more powerful. Boxers & martial artists certainly carry a lot power & speed. They some do weights, but it's not the be all end all to producing power.

I believe the trainers know exactly what there doing. No need for Louie Simmons in any camp.

Okay, amazingly you have failed to understand the point I attempted to make in each of your responses.

Quote from: Ineedtodunk on July 26, 2011, 01:23:54 pm

quote]

That is no reply or argument.

My next response would have been, no NBA team needs Louie Simmons telling them how to increase strength, no NBA team needs Usain Bolt telling them how to increase speed.


NBA players CAN ALREADY ball & dunk through genes.


They don't need those guys.

You are continuing to completely miss my point.

No NBA team needs someone to tell them how to increase strength?  So why is Brandon Jennings trying to become stronger before the next season by boxing?  Sure it can help, but not as efficiently as a proper weight training routine.  He's not gonna need to uppercut people in the NBA.

YES THEY HAVE GREAT GENES AND CAN ALREADY DUNK AND BALL WELL.  So what?  That means there's no point of improving that even further?  So what if an NBA jumps high, jumping even higher won't help?  I jump high at 38", just because I jump high I should stop?  Training to get my vert higher, will help me in so many more ways in basketball than just the vertical part.

I never said, they need real trainers to get them dunking    I said they need real trainers so they can become even greater than they already are.  Without real trainers, these athletes are clueless, hence Brandon taking boxing lessons, and AUT thinking his hops are all abs.

So yes, they DO need those guys.  Unless you promote complacency with what you've already got.

So I am a HUGE NBA fan, and I always seem to notice they're training habits as well.  For one, they train way different than most of us do here on adarq.org.  Obviously this is the case because their training is more injury-prevention/endure a grinding season/have a longer career-oriented.

But I see other things too.  Like this summer, the skinny as hell Brandon Jennings says he will do boxing and martial arts to get stronger.  Now If I was a new guy to come here on adarq.org and I said, I am a quick and athletic basketball player and I need to get stronger as it is holding me back, I don't think anyone here would advise me to do boxing or martial arts, and I wouldn't advise anyone with that either.  Sure it'll help, but wouldn't a dedicated weight training routine be the best way?

boxing will get the upper body stronger, mma training will get the entire body stronger.. as far as increased muscle mass goes, neither will provide a large enough stimulus to pack on a decent amount of lean mass.. both will get you in very good shape, but neither will get your lower body MORE explosive needed for the game of basketball, except for very small gains resulting from increased overall fitness.

I also never see NBA players training for vert/athleticism, when it can help so much for some players.  And when I do see some doing lower body lifting, they leg press over squatting.  

you've never seen kobe squatting? there's video of him squatting and benching with chains..

but ya, for the most part, nba players do sissified training.

There are more examples but I cannot think right now.  I know these NBA players are athletically gifted, and it is not their job to know these things even though they THINK they know (example, Air Up There thinks jumping high is all abs, and no legs), but shouldn't these professional trainers the NBA organizations hire know what the fuck to do?  Or are they no different from the average personal trainer at 24 hour fitness who don't know jack shit neither?

P.S.  I know AUT is not an NBA player, but you get the idea.

AUT promotes "abs and stretching".

as for nba s&c coaches, they are more worried about injuring someone than making them better athletes.. if they injure a multi-million dollar athlete, they are gone.. that's why they don't do anything above "beginner level exercises" for the most part.. for example, they stick to physioball single arm db bench press rather than regular DB/BB bench press.. they do db squatting rather than barbell etc.. they do lots of balance/"functional training movements", some of which can be good for the ankles/knees/hip stability etc, but mostly are a waste of time.

if you want to see s&c coaches train basketball players, look at the collegiate level, not pro.. same goes for NFL.. collegiate s&c programs are worried about the program, and to give them a better chance at winning in their conference/whatever, they need to actually employ REAL s&c methods, such as squat, bench, hang clean, lunges, rows/pullups etc.. the same goes for NFL..

NFL athletes who are serious about their performance, go to facilities in the off-season.. they do not train with their club.. they seek out training at dedicated performance facilities who push the envelope.. so the same applies for nfl as with nba, s&c coaches dealing with multi-million dollar athletes simply do not "risk" utilizing more effective training methods, instead they stick to "functional (bullshit) training" and machines for the vast majority of the trainers.

alonzo mourning for example would workout after every game, he was pretty jacked.. same with ben wallace.. those guys love lifting.. the point is though, that to lift the way they wanted, with actual exercises, they need to do it on their own.. otherwise, they just get the league-fluff.

nba/nfl s&c is more about "injury prevention" and maintenance of abilities, not pushing the envelope to create freaks.. collegiate & private s&c is where they push the envelope.

a good example of this, is those records they keep for each lift/test/whatever on the walls in collegiate/private s&c facilities...... ie, the bench record, squat, p-clean, whatever records.. they have the record, date, and by whom achieved it.. you don't see that on the pro level..

pc

if you want to become a better athlete in a sport you need to:

1. improve skill in sport
2. improve overall fitness
3. minimize stressors (proper sleep, diet, etc)
4. improve relative strength in compound movements & strength in individual muscle groups, both specific/important to the sport
5. ...

here's a small example:

#1. basketball is a sport than needs power/quickness, but is dominated by actual skill & natural advantages such as height etc.. Improving power will result in improved vert/speed/first step quickness etc, which will have an undoubtedly positive effect on ones skill game.

#2. competitive shotput is dominated by power/strength. One cannot compete at the elite level simply by throwing the shot & improving technique. They instead need to work on technique while getting stronger in the weight room.

this is why people such as john stockton, steve nash, gary payton, or even player's like steve kerr can compete with athletes who are superior in the power/speed department, and even dominate them.. an example of a powerful point guard would be kevin johnson or derrick rose..

you're not going to find weak shot putters at the elite level... you will however, find weak basketball players at the elite level, in fact, many of whom can actually dominate the sport due to other aspects of the sport (reaction time, perception, decision making, skill) etc.

so, in a sport like basketball, you can get by, without dedicating your life to strength..

in a sport such as shotput, you cannot get by, without dedicating your life to strength..

if basketball players want to jump higher, run faster, and thus gain an edge on their competition, they need to dedicate their life to strength... instead, most dedicate their life to skill.. most people cannot dedicate themselves to both, so they will favor one over the other, but to become the best athlete you can possibly be, both issues need to be addressed.

pretty much anyone in the nba, except the players who are already freaks (not many), could increase their athleticism considerably.. these players aren't going to achieve considerable gains in athleticism by utilizing exercises that do not address maximal strength & thus explosive strength... you aren't going to improve max strength on a bosu ball or using kettlebells or using balance exercises or using secret society medball exercises.

pc

Quote from: adarqui on July 26, 2011, 02:27:52 pm

if you want to become a better athlete in a sport you need to:

1. improve skill in sport
2. improve overall fitness
3. minimize stressors (proper sleep, diet, etc)
4. improve relative strength in compound movements & strength in individual muscle groups, both specific/important to the sport
5. ...

here's a small example:

#1. basketball is a sport than needs power/quickness, but is dominated by actual skill & natural advantages such as height etc.. Improving power will result in improved vert/speed/first step quickness etc, which will have an undoubtedly positive effect on ones skill game.

#2. competitive shotput is dominated by power/strength. One cannot compete at the elite level simply by throwing the shot & improving technique. They instead need to work on technique while getting stronger in the weight room.

this is why people such as john stockton, steve nash, gary payton, or even player's like steve kerr can compete with athletes who are superior in the power/speed department, and even dominate them.. an example of a powerful point guard would be kevin johnson or derrick rose..

you're not going to find weak shot putters at the elite level... you will however, find weak basketball players at the elite level, in fact, many of whom can actually dominate the sport due to other aspects of the sport (reaction time, perception, decision making, skill) etc.

so, in a sport like basketball, you can get by, without dedicating your life to strength..

in a sport such as shotput, you cannot get by, without dedicating your life to strength..

if basketball players want to jump higher, run faster, and thus gain an edge on their competition, they need to dedicate their life to strength... instead, most dedicate their life to skill.. most people cannot dedicate themselves to both, so they will favor one over the other, but to become the best athlete you can possibly be, both issues need to be addressed.

pretty much anyone in the nba, except the players who are already freaks (not many), could increase their athleticism considerably.. these players aren't going to achieve considerable gains in athleticism by utilizing exercises that do not address maximal strength & thus explosive strength... you aren't going to improve max strength on a bosu ball or using kettlebells or using balance exercises or using secret society medball exercises.

pc

So you would agree with me when I say that a considerable amount of NBA players can really enhance their games if they worked on strength/power/athleticism without neglecting skill work?  And that if the trainers didn't have to worry so much about injuring star players, and they made them do real work in the weight room, many great players will become even greater?

yup 100%

I cannot fathom how much sickenvendetta missed your point, ineedtodunk.