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All the elite jumpers, i.e. MJ, ACB Jr, Leonel have one major thing in common. They have a ridiculously low BFP. Someone told me that MJ was considered clinically anorexic with his BFP of 3% at one stage (obviously wasn't...).

I think there's a lot of emphasis on strength and reactivity training and not enough about getting ripped. There's this guy I train with. Same height. Same reach. Weaker than me. I weigh 80kg he weighs 72kg. He gets up higher than I do because he's skinny as. I have a higher muscle percentage but also a higher BFP.

I think people need to be aiming for <9% if they're serious about getting to 40-50".

Of course low bodyfat % is important, but the example you gave does not support this at all...

There can be numerous reasons why the guy you train with jumps higher than you....  It can be because of the body fat, but I'm 100% sure many other factors come into play.  And you can't have a higher muscle mass % AND a high body fat %....  If you're BF% is higher than his, than his lean mass % is higher than yours... His relative strength is very likely higher than yours, resulting in a higher vertical.  Even if his relative strength is lower than yours, it can still be better reactive strength, RFD, millions of things.

Being skinny and being lean are two different things.

Another example is when I weigh in before testing at 78kg as opposed to 81kg. I know I'm in for a PR or close to it since I'm only 3kg lighter. I know that could be muscle, fat or water weight, but essentially, the lighter you are, the higher you're going to jump.

At the elite level, having next to no fat is probably one of the best ways to optimise your power output, I'm guessing...

I'm not arguing that the lower your body fat %, the higher you will jump (most of the time).

But none of your examples make any fucking sense. 

"the lighter you are, the higher you're going to jump?"  WTF does that even mean?  I'm lighter than Derrick Rose, so I will jump higher than him?  Fundamentally, it comes down to power to bodyweight ratio...  Jeezus 

And if you did that test, and weighed in 3kg lighter, you probably just lost water weight.  Of course losing water weight will help you jump higher since you're not losing muscle/strength.  But why don't you just go by your theory and diet and keep losing more weight, without regards to strength.  Since, "the lighter you are, the higher you're going to jump".  If those 3kg loss was muscle, you would not jump higher.  It was water weight, which you will easily put back on.

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"the lighter you are, the higher you're going to jump?"  WTF does that even mean?

Obviously I'm talking proportionally to yourself. One day I'm 100kg, next day I'm 95kg. If I lost 5kg of fat, I'm going to jump higher. Therefore I'm lighter and will jump higher.

WOW I feel like I'm talking to sickenin vendetta again like last year in the NBA training thread...

When the hell did you say losing FAT?  Never.  If you're arguing (which you never remotely did) that fat loss = higher jumps, then.... No shit.

And of course you'll jump higher, but it's not because you're "lighter" (except some unilateral jumpers cases), it's because your relative power increased.

You were talking about bodyweight loss and fat loss synonymously idiot.  You can't just use one term as a synonym for the other.  They're completely different.  

I made one example about someone who HAS LESS FAT than I do being able to jump higher than me. Yeah, sure, we can talk about him being more reactively equipped but it's highly likely that he gets up higher because he's relatively strong and WEIGHTS 8 KILOGRAMS LESS THAN ME. Of those 8kg, probably half of them will be fat.

That part I bold/italicized, is another example of your poor arguing abilities.  What does him weighing 8kg less than you have ANYTHING to do with him jumping higher than you, if you already stated he has more relative strength?  

The part I underlined, you never said he has less fat than you dumbass.  You just said he's lighter than you.  How the fuck should I know if he's not 72kg of fatness?  A 25%BF 72kg man will have more fat than a 12% 80kg man.

LOL, of those 8kg, probably half of them will be fat?  WTF DOES THAT EVEN MEAN?!  So if he gained 8kg of bodyweight, it's not possible for him to gain 7kg muscle and 1 kg fat?  If you lost 8kg to match his BW, it's not possible for you to lose 7kg fat and 1kg muscle?

 

So let me ask you this, do you think jumping athletes focus enough on fat reduction? Do you think there should be more emphasis on fat reduction?

I think jumping athletes should focus on fat reduction if they are above 12%.  And if they are at 12% and are already over 2xBW on there full squat, I think they should pursue single digit BF%.  

I think single leg jumpers should pursue single digit BF% well before 2xBW.

Other than that, I think focusing on strength/power is more important, provided that you're not a fatass to begin with.

For the thread's sake, please don't go on about relative power.

You're idiotic reasonings make it hard for people to steer the topic away from what you want.  Like your smolov tip thread where you got sad cause people didnt give tips, but told you to not to do smolov instead.


Learn to intellectually make arguments please.

Yeah low body fat is essential coz fat is just dead weight. Most of the elite jumpers are pretty skinny guys yet still incredibly powerful e.g t-dub, darlington, guy dupuy, kadour ziani, holm, etc. I wreckon where relative strength helps out the most is with standing vertical. Once you get a higher standing vert you can transfer those gains over to running though. The only trouble with getting down to low body fat is if you're not naturally a low bodyfat kind of guy. I mean everybody can get down to low bodyfat with excessive dieting but is the dieting worth it?
With me I'd rather follow D4 advice and just get down and maintain around 12% bf while substancially increasing my strength because my lack of leg strength is my main liability atm. For somebody who has already got the strength (e.g Scooby) perhaps losing fat and even bodyweight would be the best possible thing they could do for their vertical improvement. Just depends on the individual and where they're at imo.

Nah i'm just a retard that can't spell I always thought it had a 'w' haha. Now i know it doesn't lol.

When I weigh 300 lbs with 25% bodyfat and powersnatch 900 lbs, where do you think that puts my SVJ? Right, probably a lot higher than Harvey's.

VJ height is multi-causally influenced by different things. Explosive strength (ES) and bodyweight (BW) are two important determinants but in isolation they won't be great predictors. Maybe the ratio ES/BW is the most pragmatic number to optimize during VJ training. What that means is that you can either increase ES or decrease BW. Often one will have to increase both just making sure that ES/BW gets higher. And that is all there is to it. There is nothing special about a low BF percentage except that young men, strangely enough, crave to look like the protagonists of Twilight which results in their irrational fear of putting on useful body mass.