Adarq.org

So I was talking to a guy who used to be on the track team for my school. According to him, and all these numbers seemed legit, he was 6ft flat and about 200lbs. His max squat was 365lbs and he was deadlifting about 400 when he was on the team. So pretty solid numbers. Now watching him do some vert measuring I was extremely surprised to see how low his vert was. From a standstill, he was probably about 4 inches short of the rim. Now I'm guessing like a 7'7" or 7'8" reach, not sure on that. He definitely didn't have ridiculously short arms though. Running, he hit 1-2" over the rim.
I was so surprised because I thought first of all that his standing vert would be much higher, and second that the difference between his standing and running (double-legged) wouldn't be as high as it was because he was strength jumper.
So what I'm wondering is, how is it that someone can squat 365 and be so far from touching the rim from a stand still? How can you explain the difference between standing and running vert?
He said that he never did his lifts explosively and that he put on slow-twitch muscles, hence the lack of pop in his jumps. But wouldn't the strength from his high lifts compensate for that?

Overall just confused by his stats and seeing as I'm starting up with similar lifts, I don't want to end up with no explosiveness like him!

He said that he never did his lifts explosively and that he put on slow-twitch muscles, hence the lack of pop in his jumps.

Nope, you can't do that. The fibers with most growth potential are the fast twitch fibers and even if you lift slow, your fast twitch fibers are used.

Train to be explosive, get high reactivity and RFD and get really strong = high jump!

Nothing extraordinary really. For more advanced people than novices there has to be lifts that help "transfer" gained strength in the squat to explosive movements. The squat builds the foundation and more specific, meaning explosive, exercises will have to be used to really benefit in the jump department. First step would be to include powercleans and see how far you can get with that.

Would doing plyos help his vert?
I saw the difference between his running and standing VJ as sign of some decent reactive ability, so I didn't know how he would be able to improve his reactive ability. I guess I was way off, so he would see best gains with explosive lifts and maybe plyos?

if you don't perform athletic movements (reactive, explosive, plyo etc), then your ability to perform those movements will diminish even if your "lifts" are going up.. Everything is a skill, so, not improving your body's ability to absorb/produce force rapidly is lost with detraining of explosive/reactive movements. There is no reason to periodize explosive/reactive movements, they should ALWAYS be included in an athlete's training program, it's just the volume/intensity that changes based on the type of workout or block you are in.. so ya, if someone is performing ONLY heavy lifting yet is somehow (wtf) doing all of that for athletic performance improvement, they will lose the ability to absorb/produce force fast, it's just how the body adapts..

whatever the stimulus, or lack thereof, the body will adapt accordingly..

pc

adarq, isnt that what periodization basically is

huh?

people often for some reason fall into the linear periodization mindset, working on heavy strength training with very little to no focus on explosive/reactive movements.. so for example, a "max strength block" ends up being ~8 weeks of strength work with basically no reactive/explosive work, then they shift into an "explosive block", this is always a bad idea imo.. that time spent re-learning how to absorb/produce force fast will have to occur in the explosive block, when it should have been provided in the max strength block.. so that's all i'm getting at, these people who think they should separate training into blocks that focus pretty much entirely on one quality. That's why i'm for non-linear models, which is how my ratio technique article works etc..

"He said that he never did his lifts explosively and that he put on slow-twitch muscles, hence the lack of pop in his jumps. But wouldn't the strength from his high lifts compensate for that?"

i was addressing the stuff in bold, damien already addressed the slow-twitch comment hehe.

peace man

Quote from: Rix on November 29, 2010, 06:16:13 pm

Would doing plyos help his vert?
I saw the difference between his running and standing VJ as sign of some decent reactive ability, so I didn't know how he would be able to improve his reactive ability. I guess I was way off, so he would see best gains with explosive lifts and maybe plyos?

if you don't perform athletic movements (reactive, explosive, plyo etc), then your ability to perform those movements will diminish even if your "lifts" are going up.. Everything is a skill, so, not improving your body's ability to absorb/produce force rapidly is lost with detraining of explosive/reactive movements. There is no reason to periodize explosive/reactive movements, they should ALWAYS be included in an athlete's training program, it's just the volume/intensity that changes based on the type of workout or block you are in.. so ya, if someone is performing ONLY heavy lifting yet is somehow (wtf) doing all of that for athletic performance improvement, they will lose the ability to absorb/produce force fast, it's just how the body adapts..

whatever the stimulus, or lack thereof, the body will adapt accordingly..

pc

God I love that post, this is one of the biggest issues holding people back right now and that hit the nail right on the head!

Quote from: adarqui on November 29, 2010, 09:51:11 pm

Quote from: Rix on November 29, 2010, 06:16:13 pm

Would doing plyos help his vert?
I saw the difference between his running and standing VJ as sign of some decent reactive ability, so I didn't know how he would be able to improve his reactive ability. I guess I was way off, so he would see best gains with explosive lifts and maybe plyos?

if you don't perform athletic movements (reactive, explosive, plyo etc), then your ability to perform those movements will diminish even if your "lifts" are going up.. Everything is a skill, so, not improving your body's ability to absorb/produce force rapidly is lost with detraining of explosive/reactive movements. There is no reason to periodize explosive/reactive movements, they should ALWAYS be included in an athlete's training program, it's just the volume/intensity that changes based on the type of workout or block you are in.. so ya, if someone is performing ONLY heavy lifting yet is somehow (wtf) doing all of that for athletic performance improvement, they will lose the ability to absorb/produce force fast, it's just how the body adapts..

whatever the stimulus, or lack thereof, the body will adapt accordingly..

pc

God I love that post, this is one of the biggest issues holding people back right now and that hit the nail right on the head!

+1. Wish I'd learned that two years ago. Fuck you, Tony Gentilcore.

Why what?