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Dumb people dance better
Black people are better dancers
????

Oscillatory Isos and RFI work are good ways to train the ability to instantly turn on/off contractions.  Many times athletes that have problems "relaxing" at the right times and then regaining tension when needed can see some great improvement when incorporating this type of work prior to sprinting and jumping. 

  You will almost always notice a very distinct difference between an athletes svj after performing complexes via jumps and OI's, even if not a big difference in height, the speed and smoothness of the loading portion will usually be much more smooth and performed more quickly.

 IMO, the OI's give more time to neurally "learn" the movement pattern, as you have a longer period of time to regain tension.  Progression from them into rfi drills usually works VERY well for athletes having trouble "relaxing" at the right times.  Guys who have been doing tons of strength work at a slower tempo, especially work using constant tension or slower tempos usually need them the most.

That's a good point... makes them "think less". Maybe more right side of the brain into it.

The more you think about movement, the worse it usually gets.

That's what I'm getting at. Dropping thought and just going with the flow doesn't always come natural to people who are used to actively engaging their concious brain in everything.  Alcohol can help temper down an overactive frontal cortex which tends to make movement singular and mechanical. The hindbrain (instinctual brain) is where you want to be for bodily movement . A few years back LBS's hero Lyle Mcdonald would even drink Vodka before he skated with the goal of taming his overactive frontal brain so he could become less mechanical on the ice. 

Quote from: Raptor on May 11, 2011, 04:10:25 pm

That's a good point... makes them "think less". Maybe more right side of the brain into it.

The more you think about movement, the worse it usually gets.

That's what I'm getting at. Dropping thought and just going with the flow doesn't always come natural to people who are used to actively engaging their concious brain in everything.  Alcohol can help temper down an overactive frontal cortex which tends to make movement singular and mechanical. The hindbrain (instinctual brain) is where you want to be for bodily movement . A few years back LBS's hero Lyle Mcdonald would even drink Vodka before he skated with the goal of taming his overactive frontal brain so he could become less mechanical on the ice. 

that's funny about lyle, didn't know that. only came to nutswinging on the tail end of his speed skating days so i missed most of what he wrote about his own training. closest thing i could find in a quick look around his forum was a joking suggestion to add "russian"-style events to speed skating meets, where you'd take a shot of vodka between every lap. would love to see where he actually talked about drinking while training, that would be funny.

you're still wrong, though. overactive frontal cortex* does not equal "intelligence"**. and anyway, you didn't contradict what i said. lowered inhibition and reduced overthinking are close to the same thing in my experience, especially when it comes to dancing. what does any of this have to do with "intelligence"?

back to your original question, though, and even taking "intelligence" at face value, where on earth did you get the idea that more-intelligent people tend to be worse dancers than less-intelligent people? that doesn't make sense and is not at all true in my experience.

petey0109, since when are "people that go with the flow" less "intelligent" than "overthinkers" or "overthinkers" necessarily more "intelligent" than everyone else?

also, since when did the bar for "good dancer" get set at "not being really jerky"? i can move in time to music, even sober. my movements get looser when i'm drunk, i think, but that doesn't make me a good dancer. in fact, trying to do any kind of coordinated dance gets HARDER when i'm drunk. i do care less that i'm not good at it, though. so there's that.

*relative to what? what's a normal level of cortical activity? what's subnormal and supernormal? why do those states exist? do they exist to a greater degree or more frequently in some people than others? why? how many people fall into each category? what effect do those differences have on movement? honest questions for which i'd be very curious to see answers.

**"intelligence" doesn't exist as a singular trait that you can isolate and measure, so is completely meaningless for any kind of comparative purpose. what do you mean by it?

Quote from: Kellyb on May 12, 2011, 01:10:32 pm

Quote from: Raptor on May 11, 2011, 04:10:25 pm

That's a good point... makes them "think less". Maybe more right side of the brain into it.

The more you think about movement, the worse it usually gets.

That's what I'm getting at. Dropping thought and just going with the flow doesn't always come natural to people who are used to actively engaging their concious brain in everything.  Alcohol can help temper down an overactive frontal cortex which tends to make movement singular and mechanical. The hindbrain (instinctual brain) is where you want to be for bodily movement . A few years back LBS's hero Lyle Mcdonald would even drink Vodka before he skated with the goal of taming his overactive frontal brain so he could become less mechanical on the ice.  

that's funny about lyle, didn't know that. only came to nutswinging on the tail end of his speed skating days so i missed most of what he wrote about his own training. closest thing i could find in a quick look around his forum was a joking suggestion to add "russian"-style events to speed skating meets, where you'd take a shot of vodka between every lap. would love to see where he actually talked about drinking while training, that would be funny.

you're still wrong, though. overactive frontal cortex* does not equal "intelligence"**. and anyway, you didn't contradict what i said. lowered inhibition and reduced overthinking are close to the same thing in my experience, especially when it comes to dancing. what does any of this have to do with "intelligence"?

back to your original question, though, and even taking "intelligence" at face value, where on earth did you get the idea that more-intelligent people tend to be worse dancers than less-intelligent people? that doesn't make sense and is not at all true in my experience.

petey0109, since when are "people that go with the flow" less "intelligent" than "overthinkers" or "overthinkers" necessarily more "intelligent" than everyone else?

also, since when did the bar for "good dancer" get set at "not being really jerky"? i can move in time to music, even sober. my movements get looser when i'm drunk, i think, but that doesn't make me a good dancer. in fact, trying to do any kind of coordinated dance gets HARDER when i'm drunk. i do care less that i'm not good at it, though. so there's that.

*relative to what? what's a normal level of cortical activity? what's subnormal and supernormal? why do those states exist? do they exist to a greater degree or more frequently in some people than others? why? how many people fall into each category? what effect do those differences have on movement? honest questions for which i'd be very curious to see answers.

**"intelligence" doesn't exist as a singular trait that you can isolate and measure, so is completely meaningless for any kind of comparative purpose. what do you mean by it?

You're really overthinking things here. People that demonstrate increased frontal lobe functioning think about the consequences of their actions and are apt to plan shit out. They're generally going to be observed to be more intelligent than their hindbrain dominant coutnerparts because they're more than likely have taken their education serious done their homeword, studied for tests, etc. That's different than IQ but apparently everyone here except for you  knew what I meant. If you can't see that the prototypical nerd is not inherently great at stuff like dancing you really need to get out more. Considering you're the same guy who asked what a black person is I shouldn't be surprised.  

Let me ask you something else Kelly:

Would you expect an inhibited person (the one that doesn't dance well when people are around) to dance better alone at home for example, with only himself as a "spectator"? I would

Hell if I know. Not something I've thought about that much, but yeah you're probably right.

That explains why I'm such a terrible dancer.

You're really overthinking things here. People that demonstrate increased frontal lobe functioning think about the consequences of their actions and are apt to plan shit out. They're generally going to be observed to be more intelligent than their hindbrain dominant coutnerparts because they're more than likely have taken their education serious done their homeword, studied for tests, etc. That's different than IQ but apparently everyone here except for you  knew what I meant. If you can't see that the prototypical nerd is not inherently great at stuff like dancing you really need to get out more. Considering you're the same guy who asked what a black person is I shouldn't be surprised.  

Of course the prototypical nerd is bad at dancing. That's part of being a prototypical nerd -- social awkwardness. But not all people who are good in school or good at taking tests are prototypical nerds. In fact, most probably aren't. Some of the best dancers that I've known in my life have also been brilliant students, good at standardized tests, etc. These are people who can plan, delay gratification, dedicate themselves to something and focus on getting better at it over time. Some have dedicated themselves to dancing so they're really good dancers. Surprise!

Most of those good dancers are girls because girls are less likely to get called fags for dancing when they're younger, so they get a head start on PRACTICING dance. Dudes from cultures where male dancing is appreciated may be school-smart as shit and also good dancers because -- surprise! -- they started dancing earlier, got positive encouragement to dance and PRACTICED a lot. Even if totally informally, they got encouraged to move to music as little kids so they learned how to do it without looking like spazzes. See: lots of Brazilians.

"Black" a social construct that means something like, "of African descent," and so is useless as a basis for comparing "inherent" traits. If you looked at a black guy from Detroit and a Kenyan walking down the street, you'd call them both black (so would I, we're both American so that's what we see). But there is probably less cultural and genetic similarity between the two of them than between you and me or me and Vladimir Putin. That's the point I was trying to make but which was apparently lost. And that's why the psoas study you cited is so silly -- "black" has no genetic meaning. It's interesting that the black group had bigger PMA's than the white group, but not because they're black.