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Strength, Power, Reactivity, & Speed Discussion / Re: low bar squat vs high bar squat
« on: November 20, 2010, 09:18:21 am »
AlexV nailed it: It depends, it depends, it depends, it depends.
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Yeah cause god knows you can't become stronger without ATG squatting. Elite athletes do strength exercises, they ARE STRONG, but many of them don't do full squats. In fact, I wonder how many Olympic athletes do real, honest-to-god full squats in their training, lifters aside. Or how many players within a given pro sport.
Do you think Rajon Rondo full squats when he trains? How about Vince Young? How about Chris Johnson? How about Cristiano Ronaldo? Dwight Howard? Jason Kidd? Andre Agassi, back in the day? How about Lindsay Vonn? I don't know, but I highly doubt it. Why should they invest time, energy and mental focus in steven-miller-approved full squatting? They spend all their time and energy doing important things, like getting better at their sport.
Elite athletes are often very strong/fast/amazing because of other reasons than training - at least to a substantial degree. That is also the reason why mentioned people might not even be familiar with a weight room. That however does not mean that the same source of action (becoming stronger being secondary to 6 days a week skill training for ones sport) is indicated for you and me to optimize results.
Yeah, I guess John Smith is a complete retard coaching-wise. I mean, he can't even teach a full squat! What a worthless coach.
Or maybe the guy who coached Maurice Greene, Ato Boldon, Carmelita Jeter and a bunch of sub-10 guys and a couple of 400m Olympic champs has realized throughout his decades of coaching that YOU DON'T HAVE TO SQUAT TO BE A GREAT ATHLETE. If it's going to distract from the main focus of training, why bother?
No, you don't need to squat, you can be a great athlete if you have good enough parents, too. So why don't we all choose ours instead of becoming stronger, seems like the best idea.
QuoteWeightlifting full squats demand a degree of mobility far beyond that which is required during the execution of most sport acts and certainly far beyond the working range of many athletes who might otherwise enjoy a full sporting career never having been cut short because they do not possess the requisite flexibility to squat like a weightlifter with limit loads.
The majority of non-weightlifters, in fact, would be foolish to risk the possible structural trauma that is presented as part of a cumulative result of squatting maximal loads through the entire amplitude concurrently with varied gradations of sport practice.
Anyone who states the contrary cannot possibly understand the training problems inherent to working with athletes year round whose practice of SPP yields a high structural demand to the legs and knees specifically.
This quote tells me, that Mr. Smith is unable to teach an athlete a full squat. It does not even have to tell me, he basically even said so himself since he believes that most athletes that seek his advice are not flexible enough to do more than a half squat. Can someone please tell me why we should even read beyond that? Or am I misinterpreting things? If so I apologize, since I find that post to be adding very little of substance to the discussion.
Other than this, since I openly admit not to have the experience of coaching anyone let alone athletes whose practice of SPP yields high structural demand to legs and knees, I will ask YOU, bb2020, since you posted this quote, to elaborate on the topic of the risk of structural trauma that presents itself from full squatting + sports, but not with half squatting + sports.
And if the argument runs that the difference is in lifting submaximal loads instead of maximal loads: Who here is planning to do that exclusively? I am sincerely interested since I will follow that training log very mindfully.

Are all these protein shakes healthy? I mean, they're man made, a powder "thingy"... processed basically... you can't grow or shoot protein shakes
18 November 2010
Very sore glutes , calves and hip flexors , WTF?
Decided to add the final missing link to my training, reduce bodyfat.
- 45 mins treadmill walk , HR between 115 and 120 , distance covered = 4,3km.
- My usual lower body stretch routine.
by bar position, I referred to how you squat.
IE
High bar- olympic squat, knees travel foreward and it mirrors the jumping
Low bar- more sit back involved with very minimal knee travel
I agree, strength is a general stimulus, especially when its for sport. And your right its to strengthen the musclurature not actually be the means to how your VJ goes up, or this forum would all be about powerlifting and squatting 500. But if it is just 1 rep VJ, squatting is almost a special exercise in this regard IMO and is definitely a huge bang for your buck so you want to maximize its potential in this regard.
My main point of that little rant i guess was to say that anyone who thinks that for VJ, low bar deep squat is the golden egg so to speak, they are mistaken as theoretically olympic high bar would have a greater transfer