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Messages - T0ddday

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601
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: A Journey to Running Fast and Jumping High
« on: August 26, 2013, 02:02:17 am »
Quote from: acole14 on August 26, 2013, 01:55:16 am
Two things:

1) Definitely don't run tomorrow if your hip flexor is really hurting and it's not just DOMS. DOMS you can run through OK (in fact it helps clear the DOMS out). I remember in the past you've had issue with DOMS but if it's hurting when you're just lying on your side then that's probably not good.

2) Your lower body numbers are just not adding up. For instance:

Quote from: seifullaah73 on August 21, 2013, 05:02:42 pm

Single leg hyperextension at 90 degrees: 2 x 40kg dumbell x 10 each leg

Leg ham curl machine 145kg x 3 about 15-20 degrees from perpendicular to floor

Leg extension for the quads 135kg (didn't have any more heavier) x 3 10 degree away from locked knees

calf raises leg press 2 x 135kg x 15 trying to be explosive kills all the time after


So you're doing single leg back extensions with 80kgs (!), 15 reps with >2xBW for calf raise (!!), reps with 2.5xBW with leg extension and leg ham curl (!!!), and yet...

Quote from: seifullaah73 on August 09, 2013, 03:38:29 pm

Deep Squats warm up to 40kg, 55kg x 2 sets x 3(i got pinned), 5

I'm not trying to call you out or anything, but are you sure that they're all in kgs and you're doing them full ROM? Just seems way too high for those lifts if you're only  at ~1xBW 1RM squat.

Run.  Your just nervous.  It's all in your head because it's your first meet.  At the very least go to the meet and get in the blocks and stride the race out.  Do not give yourself an excuse to get out of this.

602
400m Sprinting or Shorter / Re: Sprint Videos
« on: August 21, 2013, 12:30:20 pm »
Quote from: Mutumbo000 on August 19, 2013, 08:54:45 am

I was surprised to find out that Gemili is only 5'6. Usually short guys are more impressive at 100m.


That listing must be from when he was like 15.  He's around 5'9 now.  Certainly not 5'6.  He's also listed at 128lbs.  LOL. 

603
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: August 16, 2013, 01:29:33 pm »
Quote from: entropy on August 15, 2013, 02:27:19 am
I just want to make a note in the log that this week I've been taking an extra 4g of fish oil per day for a total of 10g. Even with a decent amount of squat volume, i'm dom free. This is new for me, i've had leg doms for the last 6-7 weeks of this squatting program. It's also made a lot of the usual pain and niggles disappear. Knees feel good. Back feels almost 100% now after the deadlift misadventure. Achilles tendinitis is reduced every day. I've not changed diet much, if at all, so the one thing which I can point to definitively is fish oil. 


What kinda fish oil you take?  This is complete broscience but when I was taking the caps I didn't notice much but I swear I felt a bit less joint pain when I was drinking the liquid version.  It was disgusting though...  Probably coincidence but wanted to get your experience.

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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: A Journey to Running Fast and Jumping High
« on: August 07, 2013, 05:08:08 pm »
Quote from: seifullaah73 on August 07, 2013, 08:38:54 am

It wasn't properly timed, but when we did the 4 x (200m 30s rest 100m) the last set we were given 1 min rest instead of 4 min rest between sets and our coach was timing us and got me around 29-30s for the 200m and then with only around 10-20s rest and run the 100m after, someone was at the end of the 100m and timed us around 13-14s.

the 500m was a proper time trial, got 1:32 on that i think.

Just the week on the start of august they said they had no meets and looks like they are starting winter season early its still summer till september, but i don't know the time they start the stuff, so it might be right time.

So was happy about. I definitely feel maybe because of my lack of upper body strength is maybe putting me down, so definitely need some weight training on my upper body.

they are sooo brutal, the long distances, i was struggling with the 300,200,100 so went to 200,100 and then they forced it down on us to run 400m 1:30 rest and run 400m so i skipped next set.

during training, it starts around 6:30, but they really start at 7:00 so when i go there i always do sprint drills and started to do sprint starts, i really don't like the long distance but if it will help in terms of 100m endurance needed then i will fight it through. But if i realize they start to run the 400m, i probably might skip training, its really unnecessary i feel as well. I can come other days maybe to track and do my training.

what do you suggest for track training i should be doing in winter session, if i can come to track in my own time and do my own training? if i see them starting to do the long distance running.


You don't sound like a very coachable athlete.  Sure, the training group that you linked up with might not be the most state of the art high-tech bunch of coaches but you would do well to heed their advice.  Simply put you are not in shape.  Out of shape athletes are REALLY hard to train.  You run a fatigued 13 sec hundred but you can't get under 90 sec in the 500m and you run 29-30 in the duece?   They forced you to do a couple 400's so you skipped out on the workout?  Why would you do that?   Running the 400m is not unnecessary!   Tyson Gay and Usain Bolt run quarter-miles; it's part of the training... blowing it off because you don't feel like it is helpful because of what you read on the Internet is just going to guarantee that no coach will spend any time helping you seriously.   Think about it, you have a 13.0 100m athlete who is convinced he knows what's best for himself (it it just happens to be avoiding the painful workouts), is sure he is a 100m athlete rather than a middle distance runner, AND goes home to his parents whenever the meets occur... Does that sound like an athlete a coach will spend a lot of time developing?  You have got to put more in before you bash the training group; show them what you have and give 100% and then they will go 100% designing training suitable to you!

No offense but if you don't like the painful workouts.... then you don't like track.  On some weird level you have to relish the burn and the pain of repeat speed endurance workouts.  Open races may be individual but you have to believe in the team aspect of track.  Track is really about not quitting, not giving up on workouts, inspiring your teammates and doing whatever necessary to inspire them and push them and yourself.  Most athletes remember most fondly the relays; it really is the heart and soul of track and if you don't like the idea of laying it all out on the line in a 4x4 because you think your a 100m guy you really aren't cut out for the sport.  I'm under six-feet and over 200lbs and was a 60m and 100m specialist.... I'm the prototypical guy who should not run or enjoy the 400...  But I'll still get out their and run the 3rd leg of a 4x4 and get the stick around the track no matter how much it hurts.... AND I will love doing it.   That's really what track is... Despite my build and performance record if a rash of injuries resulted in coaches deciding that I need to drop the 100m and run the 400m....   I would do it.    Usain Bolt started as a quarter-miler. It won't kill you.   Don't be so set on the 100m.... It seems like it's detracting from your training.   You need to decide if you like the pain and like the sport or just like the idea of running the 100m....  If you just like the idea of it then just run on your own and get rid of the clock...   If you actual like track then revise your attitude and let go of knowing everything and start doing everything.   

605
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: August 07, 2013, 04:46:15 pm »
Quote from: Avishek on August 05, 2013, 10:37:55 pm
it's not clear how bad he hurt his back. is he out of commission?

By conventional lifting I mean anything people normally do to gain strength. 5x5, smolov, anything. When you have muscle memory you can do MUCH less and gain strength and muscle mass back much faster.

So what i'm essentially arguing is that you DON'T strictly have to be patient, you can treat it aggressively and then once you're back use conventional lifting. Heavy singles will work but just going light to bring back the motor pattern is all that is necessary.

@LBSS:  While Avishek is correct, it absolutely does not apply to Entropy at all.  Totally true that you can increase a neglected lift with neural gains really easily.  Physiologically speaking this is the same reason beginners can increase every lift initially (all are neglected).   However, this is the "falsest" of all forms of strength.  It's why I would way rather have the athlete who has never lifted and maxes out his bench press at 185 than the kid who spent the last 8 months benching and maxes out at 205.  The 185 kid will be generally stronger in every way and just lacks the specific bench press coordination. 

The unfortunate thing is; unless you compete as a power lifter the movement efficiency component of lifting is useless; it has no carryover to anything but that lift!  That's why if you squat 400 and then focus on jumping for and don't squat for three months your vertical won't go down despite the fact that when you squat again you might only be able to do 350.   At the same time when you quickly (as Avishek mentioned) get your squat back to 400 you won't get any gains in vertical.  Getting the squat to 450 by building up leg strength and then focusing on vertical while your squat goes down to 400 WILL get your vertical higher than it was previously with a movement efficiency inflated 400lb squat.   

Entropy is looking for an ASSISTANCE exercise to increase aid his back strength in squat.   He is totally barking up the wrong tree by attempting to quickly build back up to what he thinks were once impressive DL numbers...   Movement efficiency in assistance exercises is silly; that's why powerlifters do 3x8 or 4x10 higher volume assistance work, the goal is always slow increase of strength through hypertrophy, otherwise assistance exercises don't carryover.  That's also why KF refers to using his assistance exercises as exercises to "add mass" to certain portions of his back to aid his squat.   It's two ways of saying the same thing.  Assistance work helps add mass or general muscle strength to a certain muscle; this added muscle makes related but not mechanically similar movements easier.   Entropy trains like an meticulous and excited postdoc rather than a traditional athlete so he probably won't heed the advice and use assistance work to his advantage; instead he will probably add fatigue to his workouts by trying to quickly recapture neural gains in the deadlift while in the middle of a intense squat cycle.... this won't work.

606
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 31, 2013, 11:52:00 pm »
Oh, 40 inch standing vertical.  I'm not even close.  Maybe 34-35 on a good day.  I'm only talking about running vertical.  I don't really get reach measurements; when I stand up with one hand I can touch around 7'8 in shoes so about tour difference is about equal to our height difference.  But, if I go on tip toes and dislocate my shoulder I can get close to 8 feet.  If I don't stretch hard it's more like 7'6.  I measure my vertical with my head cause I find it's much simpler.  I can hit my head on the backboard pretty easily so that means my vertical as at least 36 inches.  I'm far from the rim but need another object to jump for; maybe the goal post...    Surprised you are only 6'3, you look so much taller in your video.

607
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« on: July 31, 2013, 05:12:51 pm »
Quote from: LBSS on July 31, 2013, 11:08:56 am
btw fuck all you hos with your "only in-game dunks are worthwhile" shit. if i ever dunk, it will be in perfect conditions with myself or someone else lobbing the ball and no one else on the court. that will be good enough for me.

LOL.  And once you do that.... You will salivate at the idea of doing it in different conditions and start playing pickup basketball and following every single missed shot with a run-up and rim hang, hoping to get the right moment.  Then once you get one of those you will start cherrypicking hoping to get a breakaway dunk...  You will keep improving and wanting more cause thats the mindset of an athlete and that's what got you here in the first place. 

Don't you already have a 36 inch vertical jump?  If so can't you already throw down the perfect lob?  IMO it would be more impressive to see you touch 10'5 or 10'9 or whatever is sorta equivalent to that feat.

608
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 31, 2013, 05:05:32 pm »
Quote from: entropy on July 31, 2013, 09:54:35 am
Quote from: LBSS on July 31, 2013, 09:47:50 am
what's your SVJ now, again?

right now idk, but last year I think i was at 32-33" (in my running shoes) or so when i had just started dunking properly. I never measured it formally just by rim touch on my arm. I should still have that video somewhere (if you want to see it, lemme know i'll PM). Since then i can jump higher (in shitty shoes) and got a lot stronger and leaner this year, so potentially higher than that now. 40" is just a nice round number, better than 37.25" or something heh. I'll probably never formally measure either, when I can SVJ touch the top of the backboard square i'll be satisfied for my purposes and i believe that's around a 36" leap with my 98" barefoot reach.

edit - Above invitation stands for anyone else who could care to verify my claims. Would be nice to have an official 'vag certified' label for my SVJ/RVJ claim lol.


How tall are you?  I'm 5'11 and I'm out 3 inches from the height of the top backboard square but I certainly don't have a 40 inch vertical!

609
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 29, 2013, 09:23:59 am »
Quote from: Avishek on July 28, 2013, 10:13:07 pm
I stopped thinking about this stuff a while ago but I thought having long limbs just sucked for squats and lifting in general?

Entropy has body structure more like mine.. not meant for squatting well. Now almost everyone would say I have impeccable form but I feel like if my body structure was more designed for squatting I'd be lifting that shit as easily as deadlifts.

Why do some people have such small differences between deadlift and squat? I felt like it was because their deadlifts looked more push dominant because their hips were lower. My hips are naturally very high in the deadlift beacuse of my long limbs, but it makes the exercise a lot easier than squatting does.

Quote from: Raptor on July 29, 2013, 02:24:15 am
If you have naturally strong legs and naturally weak back then the difference between your squat and your deadlift isn't going to be big. Obviously structural factors come into play as well.

Obviously leverage is huge in explaining the differences between the lifts.  Long legs make it harder to squat for sure. Also, without grip strength one can't deadlift.   But ignoring grip (say allowing straps), a big difference between the explanation of the squat/deadlift ratio can be explained by the someone's athletic background.   If someone has never taken weights seriously but has played a lot of sports which involve running then 9 times out of 10 when the get into the gym and take the two lifts seriously their deadlift will quickly dwarf their squat.   In the case of Avishek it's not simply his limbs that help his deadlift but his athletic background.   Sprinting (be it in Rugby, Soccer, whatever) will train your back to be isometrically strong; and provide you with a lot of strength for that hip extension.  It will also help you in the 1/4 squat. 

On the contrary, someone who doesn't have a background involving athletics of running/jumping will have much more even ratios (some variation for body structure of course) and even more telling will be the difference in squat depths.   The first time I learned to squat I could pile on the weight and go a couple inches above parallel.... but when I was told to go full depth I had to drop the weight to slightly more than a plate.   An athletic background doesn't help much for the bottom portion of the squat.   When someone doesn't have an athletic background but learns how to squat you will notice that their full squat and their 1/2 squat and 1/4 squat are all pretty similar.   This is one reason it takes a long time for some athletes to see dividends from squatting.  They are bumping up their full squat from 250 to 350 lbs while their 1/2 squat started at 400 lbs.  In this case they still have surplus strength at joint angles used by most for jumping/sprinting.  But get a less athletic guy whose full squat and half squat are both in the ballpark 250 to bump his full squat to 350 lbs and you will see all kinds of new-found athleticism. 

610
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 28, 2013, 09:36:25 pm »
Quote from: entropy on July 28, 2013, 08:29:27 am
I think you can have a strong squat (like Craig) but have bad form (because of lack of leg mass). I think leg mass determines SQUAT form nicess. You need enough leg mass to have good form (provided mobility and what not are in order of course). I think Pat has amazing form in that video because he has plenty of leg mass. I was comparing pat to craig to show two strong guys who have form disparity and explaining the disparity by pinpointing leg mass as the causative. Incidentally after Pat's surgery and subsequent comeback if you look at his form now that he weighs around 105kg or so, he's not as strong of course, still strong though but his form is not as good as it once was because he's lost leg mass. I didn't say I was strong in a relative or absolute sense but that my legs are skinny for my squats or compare myself to those guys in any way except to say my lack of leg mass is the reason for my bad form, just as it applies to them and everyone else for that matter.  This will no doubt be misinterpreted again so i'll just leave it for now. I've come out of this overthinking phase with clarity and I don't think i'll be doing any more thinking for the next 4-6 weeks lol.

Yeah, thats the problem.   You have come to a conclusion by looking at a few youtube videos which agree with your confirmation bias.   Your body proportions have much more to do with how "nice" your form looks.   Your confirmation bias is so strong it's actually as if you are trying to make a point.  Mendez comes back after a long layoff where we all know that what one leases LEAST of is leg mass and what one loses MOST is neuromuscular movement efficiency.....   And your conclusion is that his form looks worse because of a lack of mass.....   

 I'm just trying to save you some trouble.   You will always be a tall lanky dude; you can add some mass but you will still not have the body proportions you are looking for.   However, you don't even have that bad form!  Your form breaks when you use what 90% of your max?  Pretty common.  A real form problem would be one which manifests itself when you are using a MUCH smaller proportion of your max.  When you have a form issue that ONLY shows up when the weights get big.... That's just a weakness.  Really, Raptor has given you the most salient advice.  Lift with a weight that you can use good form and bump it up while keeping form.   That will work.  Or you could get fancy and do what Raptor advised while also doing some direct work for your weak hips. (it's your hips not your ankle that causes the knee to cave in!).     Either would serve you well.   Deciding that you need a lot more mass to squat well is going to ruin your dunking and stall your progress.  But I guess in the end we need to learn for ourselves.

611
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 27, 2013, 10:24:04 pm »
Quote from: entropy on July 27, 2013, 04:38:22 am

I need to grow my calves and thighs. lol. I'm a lot stronger than my stick legs. I can move a lot more weight but my form wont get better until I actually add mass to my legs. Taking weight off to 'fix technique' will just make me weaker and waste time and solve nothing because until I grow mass it won't be solved and lighter weights wont do that. Just clarifying my thoughts in my diary no offense intended. I'm better served by continuing to progress and keep working on fixing weaknesses AND adding leg mass.

Btw the above is why Mutombo call pull 220kg like its nothing having the leg and back strength to lift it and yet he struggles to squat more modest weights. The reason is not his lack of strength, it's a lack of mass in the legs. He has thin legs which prevent him from being a good squatter - they are plenty strong though as shown by his pulls. Squat proficiency is determined by leg mass and vice versa.

What?  The reason Mutombo can't squat more is certainly lack of strength!  If could could squat more he would be stronger.   Fix your weaknesses but you are really getting off track watching elite athletes and deciding what the "secret key" is to their success.  Also, no offense but your conclusion comes off as self-serving ( eg.  I'm actually really strong but because my legs are thin I can't move the weight; these elite guys aren't necessarily that much stronger than me but have bigger legs ).   If this was the case then this hidden strength of yours would manifest itself in all the avenues that aren't specific to supporting weight in the squat.... So you would be able to run really fast; jump really high; shot toss huge weights; jerk big weights (mostly leg drive - not arms ), etc.     I'm not trying to down you but it's really dangerous to analyze a bunch of really elite guys, notice a pattern and then let your confirmation bias convince yourself this X is the key!   If squatting is all about leg mass rather than strength.... it's not really a very functional activity now is it?  So unless you are a PL... why are you doing it? 

Anyway, for years people watched elite sprinters and were certain you had to be tall with high knee action.  Then Michael Johnson came along and everyone changed what is ideal.  Now Usain Bolt rules the day and everyone talks about how great it is to be tall.  The fact is there is more than 1 way to skin a cat.  In fact there are a million ways to skin a cat!  You choose the path that's easiest for your body and gets YOU to improve the most.   But keep in mind that thats not the only way and you could always do it a different way.   I honestly have never seen you get stuck; just impatient.  Stuck is when you don't improve for a LONG time.  There will be months where you don't add weight to the bar.  You are not a beginner anymore.  Keep training; keep your form good and when you get TRULY stuck; don't be afraid to reevaluate your training...  Just to add a small reminder:



That guy is 5'8 170lbs.  He is known in olympic lifting circles for his scrawny legs and overall scrawny frame.  I don't know how much he squats but he can clean 450 and snatch 380 so I'm sure he his squats pretty damn good, skinny legs and all.  More than one way to skin a cat; no excuses do it your way. 

612
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: acole14's journal - DUNK OR DIE
« on: July 27, 2013, 02:54:29 am »
Quote from: LBSS on July 26, 2013, 09:49:00 am
USA #1!!!!!!!!!

shit, wait. just kidding.

Lol.  One of the first posts that actually had me laughing hard.

613
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 24, 2013, 10:37:44 am »
Quote from: entropy on July 24, 2013, 10:18:10 am

My thinking is the meter doesn't start counting til I reach my old PR of around ~6x120kg. From there I'd like to add another 20kg. Yes ambitious. But I haven't focused on BS so I think I have some gains to be made yet. Like even now I BS after doing my frontsquats so i'm not doing my BS fresh or anything. Also, I can ATG FS about 130kg, so that means my BS is under-achieving and ripe for pushing up easily. I've been adding 2kg a workout, 3x a week for the last month or so, haven't stalled yet so that's why i've set my eyes on 6x140kg.

Fair enough.  My fault for not following your journal close enough.  You want to get your backsquat PR 10kgs above your front squat PR with four weeks of focus.  That would sound MUCH more reasonable if your knees didn't go in like that.  Pushing a max up when you have such a mechanical problem is a bit dangerous IMO.    It's funny the taller athlete I trained; his inward knee pull was such a problem I had him switch to exclusive front squats for awhile (were the problem is not really there) which allowed him to get his front squat PR really high relative to his back squat PR...  He has since switched back and we have managed his form a bit but it is a struggle.  Speaking to your other point; it could be that your weak glutes dont stabilize you in the back squat and your knees track inward which puts undue stress on your quads.  Basically, you tall guys have weird muscle patterns!   The best thing to do might be to really figure out what causes the knee tracking inward.  I would bet it's that glute medius but it could be hip flexor.  Basically sit in a chair and track your knees together and feel the muscles on your hip/glute that are used to keep it out.  Some hip flexor work, glute thrusts, etc will go along way toward your athleticism goals.

614
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 24, 2013, 10:24:20 am »
Quote from: entropy on July 24, 2013, 10:11:46 am

I accept your points but I would like to provide some more info. Til April I was squatting 50-50% FS and BS volume for about 6 months.My BS PR was 6x117.5 around May. Since then I stopped using BS while healing my hips. Now my hips are fine I'm BS again. But this time my FS volume has gone down to like 33% what it used to be! Meanwhile BS volume is the same. I'm eating a shitload of food now (back then I was cutting hard!). So these facts bear explaining. How is that my quads are toast after backsquat. Not just doms but like during the sets and immediately after I have a burn in my legs. I'm actually experiencing what colloquially would be felt after a 'leg day'. But my total squat volume is much less now. My BS volume is low to medium thru the week. It's eerie! I used to do waayy more squat volume (with both FS and BS) and while cutting hard and still I didn't have this kind of leg soreness.

Certainly strange I will give you that.  Not strange enough to favor soreness or burn as gold standards for muscle activation but certainly interesting.  One possible conjecture:  Restrictive dieting does funny things to the body.   It could be without glycogen stores you don't get nearly the muscle pump and thus don't feel the burn as when you are in well fed state.  I don't have studies that bear that out but in my experience that seems to be true.   I have noticed this unfortunate fact on the track:  I can run a decent 60m/100m despite a pretty massive bodyweight (5'11 & 200-220lbs).  However, it's almost impossible to move down the track for the longer sprints (200m, especially 400m) when I'm heavy.  However, when I'm dieting restrictively my training times for the 200m/400m get really bad.  The race becomes LESS painful but my legs simply don't have as much strength and I feel like I'm fast but the clock says I am slow.    When I'm in a more fed state I am able to perform so much better in the long sprints; BUT the muscle pump and cramping is incredibly intense and painful.   I have not been dieting at all for the last couple weeks.  I ran 2 400m races last week (400m and 4x4).  Ran pretty well (the combo of relatively light but not dieting is of course ideal)  BUT after the 4x4 my quads/glutes/hamstrings had the most intense pump ( in track parlance is called booty-lock ).   The lactate in combination with the muscle pump was so bad I had to get to the restroom and change out of my compressions because the muscles were screaming so much.  THAT never happens if I am dieting!   

615
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: chasing athleticism
« on: July 24, 2013, 10:11:50 am »
Knees coming together is a common problem especially in tall athletes.  I've trained guys taller than you whose knees come in so close that they almost touch when he lifts really heavy weights. 

Your goal is pretty ambitious ( you expect to add ~60lbs to your 6 rep max in 4 weeks???? ) I would make an effort to fix that problem.   I've worked on it a lot with a taller athlete; X-band walks seem to help or even bands around knees with light squats.  Anything to get your hips/glute medius stronger; skater jumps also good.  If you do a set of skater jumps put your outside hand at the top of your outside hip and feel the top glute muscle that should be activated.... Get that strong. 

Your knees coming together is partially because of anthropometry BUT it's still something you need to fix with specific strength. 

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