Adarq.org

80%1RM squat for a jump squat is a lot. I don't understand why in the 100% jump squat group, poer development was higher than the squat group with 100%. The values should be less disparate at those values. So don't know if they defined jump squat RM differently, don't care nymore.

Power as measured from a force plate was also much higher in the jump squat so remember that.

Your welcome. Yes front squats do require quite a bit of force productino from the glutes as well, depth of the squat will influence this dominance issue. If you do a font squat to above parallel, it will be more difficult to feel it in your glutes.

Our discussion was originally on hang snatch alternatives, so I mentoined a jump squat, and I cited studies showing that it is more powerful than oly lifts. How is that not relevant? I already said we should not be convinced by body power analysis, in fact that is meaningless since in a power clean we are applying power into the bar, the body doesn't need to move. But bar power peaked at 80% in the jump squat and was higher than bar power in the power clean which peaked at 90%1RM. However the difference was small. bar power, the authors stated, may be important to understand in contact or throwing sports for isntance.

I disagree with you on why ai PRed in heavy back squats the day after heavy front squats as well. They may not be as different as I suggest, but the involvmeent on hips/glute is different.

Yeah low bar squat sucks, it's overly hip dominant.

For VJ high bar is way better. Steven, if you could high bar 440lbs, you'd be jumping way higher.

We haven't finished defining dominance I guess.. gotta find some studies but it has to do with the amount of force a muscle produces to lift the weight, not the joint angle.

In a sit up, you can have your knee flexed, this does not mean sit ups are hamstring dominant. In a deadlift you can have considerable knee flexion, or in a hack squat, but they are both glute dominant exercises. Has to do with lever arms as well.

Power cleans are nowhere near being as quad dominant as a squat jump because the barbell is not aligned to place stress on the quads in the same fashion in a powerclean compared to a jump squat, or any olympic lift. The bar is too far in front of the body. n a jump squat the weight is right above the center of mass.

I'm very sorry to say this, and I actually would rather not do this, but I almost agree with The Situation on this one, except "weak" isn't the right term. Feeling dizzy or feeling like passing out may not be due to poor CV fitness, but lack of proper breathing. But it's probably both for you, considerng you feel dizzy from some light aerobic work like biking.

Either you have a congenital problem, or purposely choose not to assess CV fitness by the following means
1. Reducing rest periods in between sets
2. Alternating exercises back to back

I used to do this due to the religious fear of hypertrophy. But it won't really cause you to gain as much mass as you think, most of it will be due to enhaned glycogen stores and water weight, which you can burn off from taking a few extra days off.

Squatting frequently won't make you any more cardiovascularly fit than simply doing some box jumps in between squats, or doing like 7 pushups after deadlifts, although for a primary strength exercise its better to focus on that entirely and reduce the rest period.

For myself, deadlifting heavy, and combining some upperbody strength exercises like pullups and bench, has made my heart much stronger, and it carries over to other tasks such as swimming, which my lungs would not be able to handle after just 1 lap. And I did not gain much muscle mass from doing that upperbody wise, in fact I gained almost none. Dips are another good way to get the HR up without gaining much mass. You're no where near your limit. You're no where near to even starting to create the adaptations necessary for CV fitness.

@steven-miller

I just happen to harbor the belief that olympic lifts are not as specific as simple weighted jumps, and not as good for power development compared to weighted jumps. Joe Defranco holds this same opinion, commenting on how the most explosive movement in oly lifts comes form the bar, and the spine (and the study I am about to share shows that jump squats produce a more explosive barbell movement than power cleans).

http://www.defrancostraining.com/ask-joe-test/41-strength-training/180-hang-cleans-vs-weighted-jumps-for-explosive-hip-extension.html

People like power cleans because they're called "POWER" cleans, as if they develop power. Of course they do, but so do jump squats, and the barbell jumps Daniel demonstrates. I think the jumps Daniel demonstrates, trap bar jumps, and high bar squat jumps, innervate the muscles used in vertical jumping more specifically, and more so in general, than oly lifting exercises but I cannot find EMG studies demonstrating this. Using kinesthetic senses, it is clear though that you "feel it" more in your quads in jump squats than hang snatches..


In this study here, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21777152, the researchers measured the power of the whole system (bar +body, using a force plate), of the bar only, and the body only, utilizing a single sacral optimal marker (results may have been different if utilizing a single cervical optical marker since the oly lifts require so much spinal extension), in the squat, squat jump, and power clean in 9 male college students with 2+ years of oly lifting.
 It was found that BAR peak power was higher in a jump squat than in a powerclean in all the loads used, from 30-90%1RM. Body peak power was significantly lower in the power clean compared to jump squat again in all the loads used. The maximum body power during the jump squat occurred at 0%1RM and was triple that of the maximum power produced during the power clen at 90%1RM. Same story for system peak power (measured using the force plate). Greatest system power was achieved at 0%1RM and was more than double that of the maximum from the power clean.

I have the fulltext access and just read through all of it. I can't find any studies looking at the effects of jump squats versus hang snatches though, or barbell Daniel jumps.

THis does not mean that power cleans won't incrase your vertical jump. This study here (http://people.stfx.ca/x2006/x2006nsx/Challis-2004-EXAMINATION%20OF%20THE%20SCALING%20OF%20HUMAN%20JUMPING.pdf) found that oly lifting improved sprint speed and vert more than complex training of heavy squatting and jumping. However, only the oly training group improved in the squat jump, so this does not prove anything about the topic at hand, whether or not squat jumps are better than oly lifts. In fact this raises the notion that squat jumps are better, since practising them would improve them more than oly lifting and since JS performance improved, as well as vertical, we could expect better sprint times and counter movement jumps in a jump squat program.

Other ways of analyzing this are using the tendo. But I will stop here
Edit: oh yeah, what does this bar power versus body power mean?
From the article:
"Throwers or competitive
weightlifters, for example, may be more concerned
with bar velocity and power and not necessarily body
power, whereas jumpers and sprinters may be more
concerned with body or system velocity and power."

Again, body power was triple in the jump squat versus power clean. The fact that max power occurred at 0% jump squat 1RM though is weird, i don't know if that shows us that training jumps without weight is the best strategy therefore.

This study,( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=Comparison%20of%20four%20different%20methods%20to%20measure%20power%20output%20during%20the%20hang%20power%20clean%20and%20the%20weighted%20jump%20squat.%20) which only looked at bar power and system power, found that  bar power was higher in a hang power clean versus a weighted jump squat. Results: system power was slightly higher in the jump squat, but the hang powwerclean was close, variations where huge. Without EMG though it doesn't mean much, we don't know which muscles are invovled and it doesn't answer the specificity question.

Also, were you doing any other physical activity in between those tuesdays and saturdays that month when you dropped? That can influence the neural aspect as well and fuck up all progress. Like I said right now, I'm dropping heavy deads for bounding because I won't make gains due to neural competition, or whateer the mechanism is. Happened to be in october, and now this month january.

That is nasty, but at 1:44, he looks way whiter than in any other part of the vid, he almost looks like a different person, arms look longer too. Weird. But nasty hops.

We've had this discussion before. There is no clear consensus on this forum. There are a lot of Lyle McDonald nutswingers who believe in calories in - calories out.

What determines fat storage is hormones, not the total caloric intake. Caloric intake has some effect on hormones, this is why long term reduction is a futile strategy. But again consider 1700 calories of a refined junk processed diet, and 2200 calories of pure food containing substances that maintain a healthy metabolism that the former diet does not and creates a hormonal profile that favors fat loss. If you want optimal health, muscle, and a lean physique, which almost everyone on this forum does, you would go with the higher calorie diet.

If you think you need to consciously restrict your calories to lose weight, you are in the Ice Ages. Even if every single instance of fat loss involved a caloric deficit (which it does not), focusing on this strategy is usually futile.

There is NO single instance where the cals in - out strategy of 3500kcal reduction per week resulted in consistent 1lb fat loss. This data does not exist because it is not how the body works (and 1lb of fat does not even contain 3500kcal for that matter). Calories in food are measured in a calorimeter which combusts your food. Your body does not combust food, period.

But yes it is a model. A model that naive consumers are unsuccessfully using to achieve photoshopped physiques on the front of shitty magazines, and destroy their health.