Adarq.org

http://www.jbjs.org.uk/cgi/reprint/79-B/1/13.pdf

while the VMO is found to support against lateral patellar shift between 0 and 15 degrees knee flexion(http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0268003399000893) and 0 and 30 degrees of knee flexion (http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=20292159)/'patellar centralization' as well as prevent against patellar subluxation, there are certainly far more less demanding means of training it other than Olympic style squats- SUCH AS EXERCISES PERFORMED OVER THE AMPLITUDES OF MOVEMENT THAT THE VMO HAS BEEN PROVEN TO BE MOST ACTIVE.

Weightlifting full squats demand a degree of mobility far beyond that which is required during the execution of most sport acts and certainly far beyond the working range of many athletes who might otherwise enjoy a full sporting career never having been cut short because they do not possess the requisite flexibility to squat like a weightlifter with limit loads.

The majority of non-weightlifters, in fact, would be foolish to risk the possible structural trauma that is presented as part of a cumulative result of squatting maximal loads through the entire amplitude concurrently with varied gradations of sport practice.

Anyone who states the contrary cannot possibly understand the training problems inherent to working with athletes year round whose practice of SPP yields a high structural demand to the legs and knees specifically.
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Pedestrian Explanation

Why squat deeper than half way down if it's not necessary to support all aspects of heightening sport results, including VJ score?   "

good stuff..does he/you like the 45 deg feet out?  I try to go 35 degress, but im thinking, looking at my form, its probally 45 degrees..

dumb computer moment, how do you post pictures?


SICK jumps...damn man

why do u think the extra bananas give you a boost?  Makes u shit or something?

more thoughts on olympic squats for power squats for VJ..

Power squats do allow you to lift more weight,ala why the stance and bar grip is used or preferred by powerlifting. It puts you in the best position to squat a ton of weight. Doesnt mean it puts you in the best position that corresponds to your particular goal(jumping). Also some argue less stress in certain areas(knees), allowing more long term safety.

olympic squats were in essence used by olympic lifters as a (main)assistance exercise since it isnt an actual olympic lift.  The reason this makes sense is the angles of the clean(and jerk) and the correspodance to the high bar squat. Using this logic, IMO the high bar squat would offer more dynamic correspodance to the VJ.  But as i stated earlier, it is not a directly corresponding exercise to the VJ, as you can easily be able to jump high or train yourself to jump high without it. Still if your sole goal is one rep VJ, or to a less degree RVJ, there is to strong correlation.  Strength is general to sport, and jumping, but exercise selection still need to be based on ur specific goals.

sickk

Again, im not at the position to say one is "better" than the other...just like one could argue a person could get GREAT results all doing these exercises, even though like u stated and its true the movements and muscles loaded are totally different

-high bar full squat

-low bar full squat power lifting style(no knee travel)

-low bar power style(rippltoe)

-Bulgarian Split Squats

-Heavy Lunges

- box squat wide

- box squat regular

- front squats

ETC

My view is strength is strength(unless its your sport).  If your getting stronger your getting stronger, who to say if you display it in the box squat, or the low bar squat, or the freaking BSS that your going to be better off?  Now this is taking into account that its an exercise thats not detrimental to your safety or performance and will give desired you desired adaptations(muscle mass,not kill your CNS every workout just to load it(extra high squats,leg press etc)
In terms of your statement about power snatches, I again disagree with you.  They are great explosive strength exercises, but although much harder in degree of difficulty technique wise, I do not believe any superior to other explosive strength means(jump squats, paused jumps, from box jumps whatever)

Again, this is my view on the matter and trying to convince me otherwise and that I "have" to squat till my ass touches my calves or whatever will not counter the view that i have witnessed and read about(James Smith a ton) that strength is general work and should be viewed as such.

adarq cant squat hardly a lot of weight at all. I bet he cant even bulgrain or lunge a lot, or box squat a lot. He still damn strong. My little brother squats wide low bar and defintely no where near full and has tremendous lower body strength which helped him make huge strides in speed and explosiveness while also becoming a state champ and also working himself basically into being a division one football recruit..I have seen the results personally of James Smith and how he coaches his guys, although he would not advise my forward knee travel technique at all.

But I degrees, your statement on form holds true 100% accurate.  Whatever general strength exercise you use, being orthopedically sound is THE most important issue, period.  And if my form is setting me up for injury, obviously this is something I must alter.

From a squat perspective, I always view the following in terms of safety

1) Low back rounding -  Mine I believe is fine, maybe its because im quite parallel or at parallel though

2) Knee travel-  Again I think its natural, BUT your right when mine is extreme.  My ass should be back farther.

Solution- I am going to watch ripptoes videos tonight and tomorrow, place the bar lower, although not ridiculously low,and hopefully this allows me to get ass back more and knees less.  Ill try to tape. Appreciate your input

Also, Im not trying to start an argument or be a jerk and I appreciate your input.

i guess i do high bar, but not with olympic form kind of a hybrid?  IDK tell me what you think, feels pretty comfortable

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfdwWPpbyj0