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Is the use of this similar to fool's gold when trying to achieve  PR's?  Seems like if you can't achieve the same thing without it, than it is not a true PR.

Yes, because CNS adapts to stimulants. So better not take them everyday, save them for special days ( PR attempts etc ).
Or else you will need to take higher quantities for them to work , then CNS will adapt to that too etc etc.

Yeah, me too. It feels like it is not the the need to wake up anymore, it is pure substance addiction, i get withdrawal symptoms if i don't drink coffee, like headaches, bad temper etc.

I feel you. It is no longer a performance enhancer, it just brings me to baseline existence haha. Do you ever take tolerance breaks? I keep meaning to but..life gets in the way and I'm yet to find a period where i can be completely dysfunctional for a week or so. Even if I did have time...I enjoy coffee so don't wanna spend my 'holidays' feeling like crap and not being able to sit down with a coffee and a good book.

Right, it doesn't work as a performance enhancer anymore. When i need that i drink a second one ( each of which is already way above 'double' coffee as quantity ) and i drink a redbull too. No breaks, never. Tried to cut the evening one and replace it with tea but didn't work for long, before i knew it or realized it i was back to the old habit.

Really, headaches?

Yes. Not like intense ones or migraines, more like a 'heavy head', very similar to hangover headache feeling.

^^ the caffeine addicts thread

It took me like 4 months to completely lose my addiction to caffeine. I had started taking it daily (in the form of milk+cappuccino drinks) in the morning, before work, for my job from ~2013-2015. Getting out of bed was impossible without it. Then when I quit, it took me 4 months at least before I started feeling normal again.

fastdontlie: the most potent use of caffeine as a performance enhancer, in my experience, comes when you don't take it normally, and instead take large doses before important sessions (PR attempts, dunk sessions, etc).

When you start to feel very jittery/shaky soon after taking it, and it makes you shit non-stop, that usually means you're ready to "fly".

Sometimes it can overload you though, and you just feel like you're going to have a heart attack. For example, after high doses of caffeine then a dunk session, it wasn't uncommon for me to go home and pass out.. So here I am amp'd up like crazy on caffeine, but I can't stay awake. It really helps you tap into "that much more CNS" than you normally would have .... and that becomes very draining.

I tried caffeine for running (distance), but it just makes me go to the bathroom so much (prior to running), that it cancels out the effect. Worrying about using the bathroom before a race, during a race, etc .. is not worth it. Dunk/sprint sessions however, i'd still use it on occasion to tap into some more power.

Caffeine also feels like an "artificial crowd".. Amps me up as if "people are watching".

FWIW, I sometimes put 2-3 scoops of instant coffee/cappuccino into some milk with a little honey, ~~30-60 minutes before an important dunk session. That would amp me up real good. Way better than a "monster energy" drink or anything like that.

I still get some caffeine now-days through my raw green tea, but doesn't feel like much. I try and go ~3 days without it each week, so not to be completely dependent on it.. feels like it works.

pC

^^ the caffeine addicts thread

It took me like 4 months to completely lose my addiction to caffeine. I had started taking it daily (in the form of milk+cappuccino drinks) in the morning, before work, for my job from ~2013-2015. Getting out of bed was impossible without it. Then when I quit, it took me 4 months at least before I started feeling normal again.

fastdontlie: the most potent use of caffeine as a performance enhancer, in my experience, comes when you don't take it normally, and instead take large doses before important sessions (PR attempts, dunk sessions, etc).

When you start to feel very jittery/shaky soon after taking it, and it makes you shit non-stop, that usually means you're ready to "fly".

Sometimes it can overload you though, and you just feel like you're going to have a heart attack. For example, after high doses of caffeine then a dunk session, it wasn't uncommon for me to go home and pass out.. So here I am amp'd up like crazy on caffeine, but I can't stay awake. It really helps you tap into "that much more CNS" than you normally would have .... and that becomes very draining.

I tried caffeine for running (distance), but it just makes me go to the bathroom so much (prior to running), that it cancels out the effect. Worrying about using the bathroom before a race, during a race, etc .. is not worth it. Dunk/sprint sessions however, i'd still use it on occasion to tap into some more power.

Caffeine also feels like an "artificial crowd".. Amps me up as if "people are watching".

FWIW, I sometimes put 2-3 scoops of instant coffee/cappuccino into some milk with a little honey, ~~30-60 minutes before an important dunk session. That would amp me up real good. Way better than a "monster energy" drink or anything like that.

I still get some caffeine now-days through my raw green tea, but doesn't feel like much. I try and go ~3 days without it each week, so not to be completely dependent on it.. feels like it works.

pC

since caffeine can have such a profound effect on power output, i wonder what more hardcore illicit stimulants do for it. I remember pulling a 220kg deadlift after taking DS Craze Preworkout, which later turned out to have some kind of amphetamine analogue in it.

All assuming you don't have a heart attack first that is.

caffeine actually used to be banned by WADA at a certain level... looking it up 12mcg/ml in urine was the limit

which is apparently equivalent to 8 espressos... have to say even as someone with a pretty high caffeine tolerance 8 espressos is pushing it.

from https://examine.com/supplements/caffeine/

There appears to be a reliable and significant increase in power output (both weight lifting as well as cycle ergometer measurements) in both trained and sedentary persons with doses of caffeine exceeding 5mg/kg, assuming the subject is not caffeine tolerant. Tolerance, or lower doses of caffeine, are not as effective.

5mg/kg is actually a pretty heavy dose. would be 450mg for a 90kg person or like.. 4/5 espressos.

1-3 dimethyl in ds craze. its meth like. took the grape flavor for a while. stopped when i found out about the banned ingredient.

made a big difference in mental allertness and aggressiveness. i was on it when i got 455x1 paused everyday for 8 straight weeks. and some 475x1 when i felt stronger.

miss those days. post workout crash was also as good. i sleep afterwards so no biggie.

yeah 1-3 that was it.... derived from geranium seeds. i only used it a few times but yeah it was pretty good. old formula jack3d had the same ingredient. i imagine its pretty shitty for your body to use long term though. damn i was actually like 17 when i was using this stuff, kinda fucked up they were allowed to mass market it like they did.

the "meth" talk got me lol'n.

can't imagine being on meth, or coke.. especially meth. HEH.