Adarq.org

There are a ton of stories in OLing of guys who decided to really concentrate on squatting, cut everything else way back, put 25-50kg on their squat, only to have their snatch and clean and jerk remain the same or even go down. In fact, Donny did this at one point. He was squatting about 250kg back squat, 230kg front squat, deadlifting about 250kg also, and had a 200kg clean. A bit after he got to California, he decided to really concentrate on strength, squatting and deadlifting, and cut back his practice on the Olympic lifts. He gained a bit of weight even... and got his back squat to 300kg, his front squat to 260kg, and his deadlift to 300kg. And he was still cleaning 200kg.

The point I think athletes should take from this is if over prioritizing the squat results in no progress or even regression for olympic weightlifters what's it going to result in for you as someone training for more general athletics?

http://www.pendlayforum.com/showthread.php?t=32

Some more good but more weightlifting specific quotes from that thread:

Greg Everett

There is no controversy about this in the OL world. There are individuals, largely from PL backgrounds, who claim that Olers don't place enough emphasis on strength work, and spend too much time on the competition lifts.

Glenn

And on the subject of SS and Texas Method... Ben, where do you think the Texas Method came from???? Honestly now, Donny Shankle put 20kg on his squat on this program years before you or anyone else had ever heard of it... as did many other OLYMPIC WEIGHTLIFTERS... where do you think the program came from?

Some idiot

The experts pretty much agree that in the USA the lifters are simply not strong enough. Obviously what you are doing is not working... why not take the advice of someone reputable like Rippetoe or Simmons... what have you got to lose? Isn't doing the same old thing and expecting different results the definition of insanity?

Glenn

This was confirmed with the presence of Ivan Abajiev here at California strength. Abajiev came here to coach and to raise the performance of American lifters via his proven coaching ability demonstrated with all the Olympic and World champions he had produced in Bulgaria. Things did not work out quite as planned, and Ivan, who had originally came here expecting to teach American coaches his proven system and have the athletes respond with large increases in performance, found multiple American coaches already employing a system so close to what he was trying to "teach" them that he wondered aloud to at least one individual why he was here.

Quote

There are a ton of stories in OLing of guys who decided to really concentrate on squatting, cut everything else way back, put 25-50kg on their squat, only to have their snatch and clean and jerk remain the same or even go down. In fact, Donny did this at one point. He was squatting about 250kg back squat, 230kg front squat, deadlifting about 250kg also, and had a 200kg clean. A bit after he got to California, he decided to really concentrate on strength, squatting and deadlifting, and cut back his practice on the Olympic lifts. He gained a bit of weight even... and got his back squat to 300kg, his front squat to 260kg, and his deadlift to 300kg. And he was still cleaning 200kg.

The point I think athletes should take from this is if over prioritizing the squat results in no progress or even regression for olympic weightlifters what's it going to result in for you as someone training for more general athletics?

http://www.pendlayforum.com/showthread.php?t=32

Some more good but more weightlifting specific quotes from that thread:

Greg Everett

Quote

There is no controversy about this in the OL world. There are individuals, largely from PL backgrounds, who claim that Olers don't place enough emphasis on strength work, and spend too much time on the competition lifts.

Glenn

Quote

And on the subject of SS and Texas Method... Ben, where do you think the Texas Method came from???? Honestly now, Donny Shankle put 20kg on his squat on this program years before you or anyone else had ever heard of it... as did many other OLYMPIC WEIGHTLIFTERS... where do you think the program came from?

Some idiot

Quote

The experts pretty much agree that in the USA the lifters are simply not strong enough. Obviously what you are doing is not working... why not take the advice of someone reputable like Rippetoe or Simmons... what have you got to lose? Isn't doing the same old thing and expecting different results the definition of insanity?

Glenn

Quote

This was confirmed with the presence of Ivan Abajiev here at California strength. Abajiev came here to coach and to raise the performance of American lifters via his proven coaching ability demonstrated with all the Olympic and World champions he had produced in Bulgaria. Things did not work out quite as planned, and Ivan, who had originally came here expecting to teach American coaches his proven system and have the athletes respond with large increases in performance, found multiple American coaches already employing a system so close to what he was trying to "teach" them that he wondered aloud to at least one individual why he was here.

great post

"athletes (jumpers, sprinters, bball/football/soccer etc)" who take out reactive work/sport skill work in favor of getting "stronger in the basic barbell lifts" are doing themselves a big disservice..

this goes back to another thread we have on here, posted in it recently.. if you focus so much of your effort on squat, after you've put in a shitload of work (experienced intermediate/advanced lifter), the ability to maintain a "fast 1rm speed" is crucial.. adding 50kg to squat won't matter as much if the time to complete that lift increases considerably.

pc

While I'm in agreement with Glenn Pendlay, and your post adarqui, I have a question for you: If you add 50kg to your squat, wouldn't you end up moving your old 1-RM faster?

This is a question that would definitely be more oriented towards beginners or advanced novices.

I think it depends...

Say you were finishing your 1RM in 6 seconds. If you gain 50 kg and finish your former 1RM in 5 seconds, is that enough to see a positive influence on your VJ that takes only 0.2 seconds to apply force into?

50kg is a friggin HUGE increase on your squat, and if your at the weight where you're wonder if an extra 50kg can slow you down, then ur squatting like 500lbs man. I'm pretty sure if you just play basketball or do some mod/light plyos and there's not really a big reason for your old 1RM to not increase in speed at least a LITTLE bit.

That's pretty much what I was getting at. 50kg (110lbs) is massive for anybody, and it is relatively huge for a beginner especially. If you have a guy going from squatting 150lbs to 260lbs, I am 100% sure he will gain speed on 150lbs. It will also take him less effort to do that than a guy going from 350 to 460.

That's true but you're unlikely to get any improvement in performance in those first few weeks, or even months if you're not squatting often, of massive gains while you're simply getting better at the exercise.

I think jumping three times a week while adding those 50kg to your squat (and not adding more than 5kg bodyweight in that time) will SURELLLY improve your SVJ in almost ANY situation <700lbs!

If the athlete is already proficient at squatting. You can add ridiculous amounts of weight in the first few weeks without anything like a similar increase in real strength.

^^ 100% true, but if you're going from 2.0 to 2.5xbw I would assume you'd already be proficient at squatting!

Yeah. A lot of guys do the 1xBW to 1.5xBW and go WAAAH I ONLY GAINED AN INCH ON SVJ!

Oh the joys of gaining an inch a month... long gone

Maybe, maybe not. If you do MSEM + shock I wouldn't be surprised to see 1-2" SVJ and a bigger increase in RVJ in a month. I gained 2" SJV and 3" RVJ on using heavy olys and light squat singles for stim while doing some light shock stuff. 12" DJs and RVJ height depth drops + RFI shit for ankle and foot strength and prehab.