Adarq.org

Interesting Glute article on Tmuscle

http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/dispelling_the_glute_myth


If u dont have time to read below is the points that got my attention....

when i'm jumping powerfully, when i wake up in the morning (afternoon), i vigorously extend my knees, it's not something i can even really control, it's just a very powerful contraction of the quads.. i wonder if that happens to anyone here? if i don't sprint, then i rarely if ever feel my hamstrings during the day, but when i'm doing maxV sprints, i can feel them throughout the day, much more activated.

sprints definitely activate my glutes/hams more than anything.. i had cut them out for a few weeks and definitely saw the activation/tonus in them decrease.. doing them the last few days has brought it back.

peace

more and more it seems the vj is really a quad dominant movement and the energy being trasferred through the ankles and calves so they need to be strong, elastic, rigid or whatever the term is forgot the term, but yea seems like what kelly says about it is point on that it might be a quad dominant mvmt but if you only develop those quads your gonna end up getting some knee pain or something for the muscle imbalance and you need strong glutes if you want to stay healthy

there are too many quad haters in s&c

regardless of what you actually have to work, there's one thing that can be certain you need to improve:
- maximal strength in a "squat movement" (full, half, whatever)
- explosive strength in a "squat movement" (jump squat, dj's, rea, etc)
- improve maximal & explosive calf strength (dj, reactive, calf raise)

so, what actually muscle groups that is improving doesn't really matter, it just comes down to the movement.. but in each of those movements, hamstrings / glutes & quads will all be strengthened to produce force.. chances are, the quads and glutes will experience the most strength increases, even though one would experience pretty significant hamstring soreness while progressively overloading.

other things that can't be forgotten, just to make sure i don't leave it out in case anyone gets gung ho on only focusing on those 3 things:
- improving fitness
- jumping
- upper body strength/power (push/pull)
- sprinting

so ya, regardless of what is actually most important in terms of 'minutia', improving strength in certain movements is fundamental, regardless of advanced kinesiological/anatomical/physiological mental masturbation..

but ya, in terms of running or standing vert quads play the most important role.. even in sprinting they are so very important, to be able to land leg locked and absorb all that force to help transfer through to hip extension and plentar flexion is a very important role.. there's a reason people get 'quad dominant' -> they are just used immensely in every movement.. you can do all types of short accel & jumps and barely hit the glutes/hams, but you for sure will hit the quads/calfs HARDCORE.. extend those accels out to MAX-V (50m+ , 200m ,100m etc) then you get considerable hamstring/glute, but how many vert trainees are doing those kinds of sprints? not many... most are addicted to basketball and we know what kind of sprinting is involved in that, definitely not enough to maximally recruit the hamstrings/glutes.

peace

Its like Quads used to be overated and now they are way underated (to MOST people, calm down darq calm down  )

same thing with calves, they used to be overated and are now underated....(to MOST people)

You could so easily make a great jump program Andrew, i thought of this after you said

Quote

regardless of what you actually have to work, there's one thing that can be certain you need to improve:
- maximal strength in a "squat movement" (full, half, whatever)
- explosive strength in a "squat movement" (jump squat, dj's, rea, etc)
- improve maximal & explosive calf strength (dj, reactive, calf raise)

AND WE'VE ALL HEARD SOME PEOPLE IN THE S&C INDUSTRY SAYING "QUADS ARE USELESS, AN ATHLETE WOULD BE BETTER OFF WITHOUT THEM" TO ME A SAYING COULD NOT BE ANY MORE STUPID

ya i can't stand the people that diminish the quads/calfs importance, makes no sense.. they are so obsessed with 'p-chain' that it is laughable.



*calms down*

I think the problem is that people take great quads for granted.

I realize this is an old thread but...

I couldn't agree more.  In fact years ago Tom Myslinski posted on elitefts the same sentiments.  Quads are important during acceleration, and are VERY important for deceleration.  Jumping is driven by glute, quad, and calf function.  Ankle stiffness (calves) are important for sprinting speed.  So basically if you play a sport other than track, quads are very important. 

The quad backlash came from the squat/olympic sc programs that STILL dominate the sc community.  Those of us here are smart enough to know that glutes and hams are more important for speed development but that fact is lost on 90% of the sc community.  Us smart folk are just a small slice of the pie and are no where near a representative sample.

But in the end it is all about balance.  You need enough pchain strength/power to reach full extension at toe off.  Strong enough quads to stop quickly, turn, and jump.  Enough ankle stiffness to handle all the forces of acceleration and top speed sprinting.

GREAT POST ALEX!

Us smart folk are just a small slice of the pie and are no where near a representative sample.

sooooooooooooooooooooo TRUE!

In my opinion, and it seems that I'm alone in this - if you're a one-leg jumper you can get away without having too much posterior chain strength if you have great quad strength. If you are able to transform the horizontal movement into a vertical movement, and that's done with the help of the quads, then you can use a long run-up in which you build up speed (and therefore you have initial force) and then just switch it vertically.

If you run fast towards the plant point and are able not to collapse at the knee, I don't think you need that much posterior chain strength to jump very high.

calfs are part of posterior chain.. i'm with you on the 'hamstring aspect', i mean even single leg jumps I would put more emphasis on quad/calf/glute, in that order, but there definitely is more hamstring recruitment in SLRVJ versus DLRVJ..

but i'm with you for the most part, quads remain highly underrated

Quote from: adarqui on June 06, 2010, 06:27:54 pm

when i'm jumping powerfully, when i wake up in the morning (afternoon), i vigorously extend my knees, it's not something i can even really control, it's just a very powerful contraction of the quads.. i wonder if that happens to anyone here?

peace

I've told you how that happens to me..

ya i remember.. wonder how many other people that happens to!